SDI Solo Diver cert

We arrived back from Bonaire yesterday. I'll post a quick trip report
on .locations later.

On Monday, I took the SDI Solo Diver class with Walt Stark, something
I've been interested in doing for a long time. The class was pretty
short, but I was mainly in it for the nifty card and appreciated it
not taking up too much of my vacation downtime. Janna took the class
with me, but due to a cold, couldn't clear on the cert dive. Walt
offered to waive her class fee, which was a nice gesture.

Lou Vallone posted a report on the class here a few years ago. It
looks like he got a little more for his money but I'm still happy.
I'll repost an excerpt for comparison's sake, and to save wear and
tear on my fingers:

> Walt Stark was the instructor. He spent some time going over my log books (I
> have several hundredsolodives logged in them - I brought with me the ones
> from previous Bonaire trips.)

He didn't go over our logbooks, though he did ask us to bring them to
class. Maybe he forgot. He did want to see some proof of advanced
certification so I pulled my TDI Pass Flying cert card out of my stack
of 30-or-so cards and that seemed to appease him.

> We spent time discussing the reasons and circumstances appropriate forsolo
> dives (he had a pre printed syllabus). We also discussed various gear
> requirements for the endeavor. This "instructional" part was informal, peer
> to peer dialogue more than lecture and took a couple of hours. I had
> previously read (can't remember the author's name at the moment) the book
> "SoloDiving" and we discussed that. We also traded horror stories about
> buddy diving experiences we had each had.

Same here, sort of an informal socratic style of class. No video. No
text. No written exam. He brought up the legal liability that a
buddy relationship can cause. Personally I think a decent lawyer
could dispel any notion that an involuntary buddy assignment can
create a legal duty of care, but I didn't bother haggling over the
issue with him.

> Two dives are required. For the first one, he became an observer for the
> most part as I assembled my gear and stated my dive plan. He then followed
> me through an 80 minute shore dive at La Machaca reef during which I did
> basic skill things like doff and don, mask flood, etc. He would take note of
> the frequency with which I checked gas supply, depth, time and so on. He
> watched my general demeanor, buoyancy, trim, awareness of environment and
> general comfort and handling of myself underwater. We hit a max depth of
> about 75 fsw. (FYI, I dove 32% Nitrox on an air computer.)

This is where the class seemed to differ. I did two dives too, but
only one with Walt. Max 64' for only 47 minutes. This dive included
most of the stuff that Lou mentions below, but no other exercises. No
mask clearing or doff/don. Awareness of environment was tested by his
asking about the direction of the current. He was observing me the
whole time though. Spent about 5 minutes trying to get Janna to
clear, then ascended to send her swimming back to shore. Redescended
and did a swim back and forth along the reef for 20 minutes at 60' in
order to get pressure readings to calculate SAC rate.

> During the surface interval, we talked about some of things we saw on the
> dive and had just general conversation that two divers would have about a
> dive.
>
> For the second dive, he outlined before we entered the water what I would
> have to demonstrate as the skills for thesolodive cert:

After the 20 minutes were up, we returned to our starting point and
did the solo skills.

> 1. Simulate an out of gas situation at 60 fsw by removing my primary
> regulator from my mouth.
>
> 2. Switch to my independent gas delivery system - which in my case on this
> dive was a 3 cu f Spare Air.

I used a 30 cf pony, a bit more realistic. We did discuss how
worthless SpareAir can be in a real OOA situation.

> 3. Ascend to the surface at a rate no faster than 60 feet per minute (no
> safety stop planned).

Walt stressed having enough redundant air for a safety stop, and we
ascended to 15' and did a 5-minute stop on the pony before switching
back to the primary.

> 4. At the surface, orally inflate my BC.
>
> 5. Orally inflate and wave my surface signaling device: an 3' orange
> sausage.
>
> 6. Activate my audible surface signaling device: a whistle.

We swam underwater back to the dock before ascending in 4' of water
(i.e. standing up). He didn't have me orally inflate my BC, but I did
try to inflate my sausage. Turns out the valve had frozen shut since
the last time I used it. I ended up pulling out the valve to blow it
up. I volunteered that the experience would teach me to check my
safety gear in the future. He gave me "points" for at least being
creative enough to pull out the valve. He didn't require me to make
any audible signals, maybe because I didn't have an audible signaller
other than my loud scream, but we did discuss various signalling
devices in the class.

> 7. Take a heading with my compass to ascertain my shore exit point.

> 8. Surface swim to the exit point - which I choose to do on my back instead
> of with a snorkel. Exit the water and disassemble and store the gear.

He did test my use of a compass before our dive, having me run a
reciprocal course for 20 kicks in each direction.

> After we exited, we discussed my level of comfort with the exercises. He
> gave his opinion of how well I executed them and he declared that I had
> passed the course. He provided me with some waiver forms fromSDIthat I can
> give to operations if they wish to have them on file if I divesolowith
> them.

After we exited and doffed our gear, he assessed me as being
comfortable in the water and did a remarkable job of calculating my
SAC in his head in a couple seconds. Then he had me do dive two as my
final exam: come back from a solo dive alive and I pass the course.
We discussed my dive plan, had me figure out how much air I should use
during the dive, and away I went. I kept it short since Janna was
waiting patiently, 27 min total, half at 80' and half at 40' I
switched to the pony and breathed off it for a bit, then switched back
and made my ascent.

Walt greeted me from the top of the stairs to confirm I was alive,
then we reconvened for a short while back in the classroom after I had
doffed and rinsed my gear. He had the SAC calculations on the
chalkboard, we reviewed them, talked a bit about the class, and he
offered to send me a PDF of the waiver. A nice guy. I wouldn't mind
taking a tech class from him in the future.

(SAC was only .56 CFM, but we were heading against a little current
for half the 20-min swim and I was admittedly a bit nervous knowing
that he was observing my every move.)

dechucka wrote:
> What benefit does a "solo card" give you? Does it allow you to dive alone
> from commercial dive boats?

On the DWG-II trip to S. Florida, the LDS we went with for the trip to
the Spiegel Grove had a space on the waiver form for your partner's
name... I either put Davey Jones or Charles Darwin on it... They looked
it over and didn't seem to have a problem with it... Of course, it's
possible with as much harassing and joking around we had been doing at
that point, we had confused them enough that they had no idea who was
probably even diving... This was after Lee had already given them his
YMCA "Skin Diver" card from 1969 and I had given them my PPL when that
asked "if I had a card"... <evil-grin>

Lee Bell wrote:
> If I were to be caught diving in any quarry, someone should check to see
> what's happened to my mind. There's a reason why I live in Florida and
> diving in cold, dark quarries is not part of it. Should I decide otherwise,
> there's always 40 Fathom Grotto or, for that matter, the rockpit behind my
> house we call a lake. Let me know when you're down and I'll let you solo
> dive in it to your heart's content.

How deep is that lake behind your house... The water seemed quite a bit
clearer than most Texas lakes...

On Mar 26, 6:35 pm, "Lee Bell" <pleeb...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> Greg Mossman wrote
>
> > If they have no legal liability, what's their issue?
>
> Control.
>
> Congratulations on your new card.

Thanks. The hardest part about it was finding somewhere to take the
class.

> I'm jealous.

You and everyone else. That's half the reason I bothered to get it!

Actually it was nice taking a SCUBA class for a change. I haven't
done that in years and it was a good warm-up to my tech class coming
up in June which I imagine will be a bit more intense.

"Greg Mossman" wrote

>> I'm jealous.

> You and everyone else. That's half the reason I bothered to get it!

Then I'll have to disappoint you with your claim to "everyone else".

I refuse to dive with you when you're using that cert.

Grumman-581 wrote

> Lee Bell wrote:
>> If I were to be caught diving in any quarry, someone should check to see
>> what's happened to my mind. There's a reason why I live in Florida and
>> diving in cold, dark quarries is not part of it. Should I decide
>> otherwise, there's always 40 Fathom Grotto or, for that matter, the
>> rockpit behind my house we call a lake. Let me know when you're down and
>> I'll let you solo dive in it to your heart's content.

> How deep is that lake behind your house... The water seemed quite a bit
> clearer than most Texas lakes...

I don't know. It's 30 or 40 feet directly behind my house. It may be
deeper elsewhere. Next time you're down/over, you can explore it.

Lee

"Lee Bell" <pleeb...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
> You either live free, making your own choices, or you bow to the will of
> those who would make them for you.

True enough. In this case, it is the decision of the property owner
as to how many rules he wishes to impose on his (paying) guests. The
same thing has happened in places other than PA ... in fact, I even
seem to recall a cave somewhere in FL that's in a State Park that's
off-limits to the public except for one small, self-selected group of
WKPP'ers.



> > They do have spotters on the bluff watching, and ocaisionally, in boats
> > on the water. Can they see everything everywhere? Not likely, but woe be
> > unto them they do see and catch. Furthermore, many instructors and DMs
> > holding classes there act as "deputy employees" while underwater
> > (which, in turn, gives them free diving priviliges).
>
> These are the people you choose, even pay to dive with? You can do better,
> much better.

For better or worse, its one of only a very few training sites, and
its water conditions are about the best. Water clarity is actually
better today than 20-some years ago, because it has become
contaminated with zebra muscles. The catch is that this means that
you need to give your dive gear a IIRC 10 minute soak in 130F water to
prevent shit from growing inside your regulator, etc.


> The people diving in this quarry of yours have nobody to blame but
> themselves. Those that operate the quarry depend on your money for the
> survival of their business. You, and others like you, have the power to
> effect change, if you care enough to do so.

They have an established business relationship with nearly all of the
local diveshops, who take their OW classes there. I'd venture to
guess that that's 75% of their attendence. Probably half that are
left are NJ Wreck divers who will come over for a couple of dives in
flat waters before taking a new rig configuration off the coast.

There have been some alternatives - - there's Bainbridge, but I think
they're pretty far out to the west for Arnold & NewJersians. Might be
worth a look to see if Willow Springs is still in business. There
also used to be diving allowed at Round Valley State Park in NJ, but
that's a mudhole.


> > They want to know *precisely* where you are...... and that you are moving
> > at least (ie. not "stationary" for any significant length of time).
>
> Seems even sillier. So, if you're still long enough to get their attention,
> they presume you've drowned and come to get the body? For this, you pay a
> fee?

IMO, it might be interesting to run an "oops I dropped my transponder
a half hour ago" test to see how seriously they're taking their
*claimed* duty of care, or if it is (as I suspect) a cash extraction
policy.


> No wonder you're coming down to dive with us Floridians.

Because a Bad Viz day in FL still usually beats a good viz day up in a
PA quarry, plus the bottom temperature's usually at least a good 20F
warmer



> In all seriousness, the rules at your quarry are too restrictive for my
> taste.

But wait, there's more ... during the long form you're required to
fill out to get your little sticker, one of the pieces of your
information that they want is your SSN#.

When I was last there (2002), the kid in the registration booth was
having problems finding my SSN# on my C-Card (he should, since its not
on there) and then essentially accused me of having a forged C-Card
because it was absent. I told him to check the date on the Card ...
and as he did, I said, "What year were you born, son?". Seemed to
have cleared the whole paperwork problem right up


> There are better ways and better places to dive and, thanks to years
> of hard work and a bit of luck, I can afford to dive them.

True enough. Problem is that when it comes to freshwater pockets
around these parts, most of them are utter mudholes that take a
special talent to like. The few spots with clear water and access
are private and they can follow "what the market will bear"
capitalism.



-hh

-hh wrote

>> You either live free, making your own choices, or you bow to the will of
>> those who would make them for you.

> True enough. In this case, it is the decision of the property owner
> as to how many rules he wishes to impose on his (paying) guests. The
> same thing has happened in places other than PA ... in fact, I even
> seem to recall a cave somewhere in FL that's in a State Park that's
> off-limits to the public except for one small, self-selected group of
> WKPP'ers.

It certainly was off limits and may still be. I've not followed anything
relating to that spring or the group. There's another spring in Florida
that is more readily accessible to those with GUE certifications than to
others and all the developed spring/cave sites owned by the state require at
least a cavern certification to take lights into the water. There are still
a few caves and caverns that are not under such rigid control.

Lucky for me, there's no shortage of fresh or salt water to dive in down
here.

> They have an established business relationship with nearly all of the
> local diveshops, who take their OW classes there.

Only so long as the divers that do business with those shops continue to
support the practice.

I'd venture to
> guess that that's 75% of their attendence. Probably half that are
> left are NJ Wreck divers who will come over for a couple of dives in
> flat waters before taking a new rig configuration off the coast.
>
> There have been some alternatives - - there's Bainbridge, but I think
> they're pretty far out to the west for Arnold & NewJersians. Might be
> worth a look to see if Willow Springs is still in business. There
> also used to be diving allowed at Round Valley State Park in NJ, but
> that's a mudhole.

I don't know what's available in the area, but it didn't take much effort to
find this http://www.metrojersey.com/riverslakes.htm

> IMO, it might be interesting to run an "oops I dropped my transponder a
> half hour ago" test to see how seriously they're taking
>their *claimed* duty of care, or if it is (as I suspect) a cash extraction
>policy.

I must admit that the idea of stopping for 15 minutes or so to closely
examine (not moving) something interesting occurred to me. If they don't
come looking for a non moving diver in that time, they're going to have a
hard time defending their position that it's for the diver's safety.
Perhaps I was not too far off on my "gear recovery" suggestion.

> But wait, there's more ... during the long form you're required to
> fill out to get your little sticker, one of the pieces of your
> information that they want is your SSN#.

Violation. You're not required to provide your SSN to anyone other than the
government and those you have financial transactions with, banks, brokers,
lenders.

> When I was last there (2002), the kid in the registration booth was having
> problems finding my SSN# on my C-Card (he should,
> since its not on there) and then essentially accused me of having a forged
> C-Card because it was absent. I told him to check the
> date on the Card ... and as he did, I said, "What year were you born,
> son?". Seemed to have cleared the whole paperwork
> problem right up

I like it.

> True enough. Problem is that when it comes to freshwater pockets around
> these parts, most of them are utter mudholes that take
> a special talent to like.

I would think that quarry diving would fall into that category as well.

> The few spots with clear water and access are private and they can follow
> "what the market will bear" capitalism.

Nothing wrong with capitalism, especially if it's used to help those
providing goods and services understand who is paying and who is getting
paid. Those in business to make money, only retain control of the nature of
goods and services as long as the paying customers let them.

Lee

On Tue, 27 Mar 2007 02:04:19 GMT, mag3 <zmpmag3-plongee@yahoo.com>
wrote:

>On Mon, 26 Mar 2007 21:33:01 -0400, "Lee Bell" <pleebell@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
>>You either live free, making your own choices, or you bow to the will of
>>those who would make them for you. I choose to live free. I always have.
>>If that means I can't dive in their quarry, so be it. They're not welcome
>>in my lake either.
>
>Fair enough... I can live with their polices for now.
>
>>
>>> They do have spotters on the bluff watching, and ocaisionally, in boats
>>> on the water. Can they see everything everywhere? Not likely, but woe be
>>> unto them
>>> they do see and catch. Furthermore, many instructors and DMs holding
>>> classes there act
>>> as "deputy employees" while underwater (which, in turn, gives them free
>>> diving priviliges).
>>
>>These are the people you choose, even pay to dive with? You can do better,
>>much better.
>
>Not really. Not any that are as convenient as this place. Less than 1hr from my
>residence - lots of artifical wrecks, guide ropes to get to them, other things. And it
>*is* where all the LDS's do their training in this area. If I wanted to take any classes
>at an LDS, the checkouts would almost likely be there (except for any "ocean" boat
>dives off the NJ shore)...
>
>>The people diving in this quarry of yours have nobody to blame but
>>themselves. Those that operate the quarry depend on your money for the
>>survival of their business. You, and others like you, have the power to
>>effect change, if you care enough to do so.
>
>More complicated than it seems in this case. As stated, most of the LDS's in this
>area do their training there. So you'd have to effect the change through them as
>well, and I'm sure that Dutch has cut their own sweetheart deals with them....
>
>>> They want to know *precisely* where you are...... and that you are moving
>>> at least (ie. not "stationary" for any significant length of time).
>>
>>Seems even sillier. So, if you're still long enough to get their attention,
>>they presume you've drowned and come to get the body? For this, you pay a
>>fee? No wonder you're coming down to dive with us Floridians.
>
>I'll dive anywhere I can. The more diverse the ops, the better. I learn more that
>way. I think if one were not to move sufficiently, they'd send a DM or an instructor
>out to look for them, or they'd take out a boat or something.
>
>
>>
>>>>Anyone that fails to sign out is presumed to be on the bottom somewhere.
>>>>The next day, everyone pays a little extra to join in the treasure hunt.
>>
>>> Liability concerns would not permit them to wait that long. Operations in
>>> this
>>> part of the country seem a good deal more "litigation conscious" than
>>> other parts.
>>
>>Dead is dead. In fact, dead is better, from a purely financial liability
>>standpoint than permanently injured. They should wait the day.
>
>The big question is their insurers. What would they require?
>
>>In all seriousness, the rules at your quarry are too restrictive for my
>>taste. At best, I'd dive with them once. More likely I'd insist on a
>>refund, walk away and anyone who would listen against doing business with
>>them. I'm not particularly friendly with those who think they control my
>>life, or my diving, or even want to. There are better ways and better
>>places to dive and, thanks to years of hard work and a bit of luck, I can
>>afford to dive them.
>
>Understood. Like I said, I can live with their rules for now. Perhaps when I get
>to the point where I have enough dives that I don't need a facility like that, I
>might not choose them as readily (or if I ever move down your way etc.).
>
>____________________________________________
>Regards,
>
>Arnold
I guess they would flip out if you tried to use a rebreather, they
wouldn't have bubbles to watch.
By the way Bainbridge shouldn't be that far away.

""Magilla"" <cavey_curtis@$$ yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:_m3Oh.198233$5j1.187723@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
>
> "Greg Mossman" wrote
>
> >> I'm jealous.
>
> > You and everyone else. That's half the reason I bothered to get it!
>
> Then I'll have to disappoint you with your claim to "everyone else".
>
> I refuse to dive with you when you're using that cert.

Bob?

Laugh of the day candidate?