Bjorn on Hugh Huntzinger and rec.scuba

From: Pmcduffee (pmcduffee@aol.com)
Subject: Re: Bjorn on Hugh Huntzinger and rec.scuba (was Re:
Hugh Huntzinger's Self-Appointed Photo Editing Clinic)
Newsgroups: rec.scuba.locations
Date: 2004-03-22 19:02:38 PST

>From: Large_Nassau_Grouper@Yahoo.com (Reef Fish)
>Message-ID: <8fb7380b.0403210521.3a593de9@posting.google.com >
>pmcduffee@aol.com (Pmcduffee) wrote in message
>news:<20040319205552.01800.00000104@mb-m03.aol.com>...
>> >From: Large_Nassau_Grouper@Yahoo.com (Reef Fish)
>> >Message-ID: <8fb7380b.0403182308.64dd1052@posting.google.com >
>> >ronleenospam@pcisys.net (Ron Lee) wrote in message
>> >news:<405a6890.1664524@news.pcisys.net>...
>> >
>> >
>> >> Bob, this is the second atrocious mispelling in the last week or
so.
>> >
>> >Ron, you're REALLY slipping. I misspelled at least 100 times
within
>> >the last week or so in my posts.
>> >
>> >
>> >Ron, is misspelling "misspelling" as "mispelling" in your own
>> >inditement statement more, or less, atrocious?
>> >
>> >-- Bob.
>>
>> Reef, take a deep breath (:))
>>
>> Pat
>
>Pat, I was just trying to help Ron to up his count! (:)))
>Some silly bullshark grabbed the bait instead. <:0)
>
>-- Bob.
>

> Reef take a grip.

Pat,

You post infrequently, and not many folks know that I've known you
in cyber space since the days you were a frequent participant in
Scuba-L, in the early 1960s.

I have ALWAYS held you in high regard, for all the reasons one would
hold anyone in high regard, and I STILL DO, and WILL continue to do.

Which is why I felt the need (for YOU and the serious readers in this
forum) to post a detailed reply to your succinct lines, so that
you can understand what you apparently misunderstood, of the
background in THIS thread, and related threads in which Ron Lee
and Lee Bell participated, as well as the REASON I act as I do, to
their posts (gratuitous and unjust attacks).

>
> You do tend to let's, we say take a ride on the wild side.

Yes, I am adventurous. ;<)

>
> You are very well versed in the debate, and you are always very factual.

I thank you for your OBSERVATION, which I value as a compliment --
THAT itself speaks a LOT, coming from you, because both
Hugh Huntzinger and Lee Bell have been calling me LIAR on things
factual I have posted. That's only ONE of the reasons I am not
shy to defend myself, against such charges.


>
> But sometimes you, erm, just just loose it.

I understand what you mean, though you misspelled "lose".
That's where a host of Mental Midgets climbed on Ron Lee, Lee Bell,
and Hugh Huntzinger's lynching parties (or Feeesh BBQ as Hugh called
it in ancient times). Frivolous attacks of my SPELLING -- by Ron
Lee, who misspelled "misspell" and was oblivious to the irony of
it, was the subthread in which you entered that led to this.

>
> Don't get so personal.

This advice is appropriate on most occasions. Unfortunately, in
the case of Ron Lee and Lee Bell -- the attacks are VERY PERSONAL,
and in gratuitous ways -- against which I took pains to explain why
they and their attacks were WRONG.


In Hugh Huntzinger's case, the attacks were even MORE personal than
Ron Lee and Lee Bell's personal attacks. Hugh took pains to TWIST
the content of my posts, fabricate LIES, and turned around to
attack me on ths basis of his fabricated lies.

Hugh's PERSONAL attack on me was based his own GRUDGE against ME,
stated publicly in Scuba-L, and not disputed by him in rec.scuba,
that he has held the same GRUDGE since 1996.

I tried SEVERAL times, in rec.scuba (documented) to conduct a
discussion with him, in good faith, including complimenting his
post on one occasion when I entered -- to no avail. Each time
Hugh turned it into his own personal GRUDGE battle. The present
threads on my Memorable Dive at Las Palmas, and the pix I posted
about that dive started exactly that way.

I made a post. Hugh responded. I responded to Hugh in good faith,
without the slightest rancor or the intention fo start or continue
any old arguments we have had. Alas, on EACH of those two occasion,
it was soon apparent that Hugh had NO INTENTION to do any
ordinary discussion on the subject at all! He was there to
find the excuses, the slightest ones, to manufacture FALSE
STATEMENTS about what I said, and made flamewars out of them.


It's ALL in the google archives of those threads. As I said in
the original post of THIS thread, on what Bjorn posted, about
Hugh, and me -- don't take Hugh's words or mine -- go READ the
entire thread in the archives and judge it for YOURSELF.


I have stated many times in the past that I hold NO GRUDGE against
anyone, and I judge any post on a POST by POST basic, and I would
AGREE or DISAGREE with anyone, friend of foe, on the substance of
a post -- independent of past or present friendship or lack
thereof.

That's the way it is!

This SHOULD be a clickable URL. If it's not, you can manually
retrieve it in the "advanced groups search" of groups.google.com
using AUTHOR = "reef fish" and search keywords "joel apology",
as indicated in the URL below.

http://groups.google.com/groups?q=jo...son.edu&rnum=1

It is a VERY LENGHY post, even by MY standards of length. But I
know you'll not have any problem or complaint against length, and
call all of my lengthy posts as rants -- which this one would
surely qualify, in the eyes of my critics and flammers.

It contains MANY consistent elements in my INTERNET practice:

1. I hold NO GRUDGE against anyone.

2. ACTION speaks louder than WORDS.

3. I do not shy from DEFENDING against from personal attacks, but
as soon as the case is over, whether the mugger apologizes
(extremely rare), or even just stop making unwarranted attacks
and leave, it's OVER and DONE.

4. Joel DeRegla was an Aldora IDIOT, just as Ron Lee was. Joel and
most other Aldora IDIOTs got over it, long time ago, when they
finally understood my position about Aldora, which I stated in
that post, as well as elsewhere. It's my CONSISTENT position,
diametrically opposed to what Aldora IDIOTs say I do. Ron Lee
is still singing the same old tune about "name calling" without
regard to the SUBSTANCE behind such name-calling, which always
ceases, as soon as the IDIOTS stop their idioting acts.

>
> You are good, but lighten up just a tad.
>
> Jmhop,
>
> Pat

Thanks, Pat. I hope after seeing this detailed reply to your
well-intended and fairly put advise, you're in a much better position
to understand what I say or do in the present rounds of 3-ring-
flamewars in rec.scuba, complete with minor side-shows.

-- Bob.

Yes. I call you a Friend because you are a Friend. I like your
sig, which did not show in your post when I took it to this reply
mode.

Reef Fish wrote:

> It contains MANY consistent elements in my INTERNET practice:
>
> 1. I hold NO GRUDGE against anyone.

unless they say anything that you could misinterpret
as negative to you and your position.

then immediately they are an idiot or an asslicker.

>
> 2. ACTION speaks louder than WORDS.

long nitpicking diatribes complete with foul abuse...

>
> 3. I do not shy from DEFENDING against from personal attacks, but
> as soon as the case is over, whether the mugger apologizes
> (extremely rare), or even just stop making unwarranted attacks
> and leave, it's OVER and DONE.

talk about two faced.
talk about blaming others for your own childish actions.

> Thanks, Pat. I hope after seeing this detailed reply to your
> well-intended and fairly put advise, you're in a much better position
> to understand what I say or do in the present rounds of 3-ring-
> flamewars in rec.scuba, complete with minor side-shows.
>
> -- Bob.

>Reef Fish wrote:

>> 1. I hold NO GRUDGE against anyone.

But a dive shop in Cozumel (Aldora) led you on a years-long jihad
against them and anyone who used them
>>
>> 2. ACTION speaks louder than WORDS.

All I see from you is childish language.

>> 3. I do not shy from DEFENDING against from personal attacks, but
>> as soon as the case is over, whether the mugger apologizes
>> (extremely rare), or even just stop making unwarranted attacks
>> and leave, it's OVER and DONE.

Let's put this comment in perspective. Bob can call me names for zero
reason and that is not a personal attack. But when I explain to him
that his incessant namecalling is childish...that is a personal
attack. Are you a liberal Bob?
>>
>> -- Bob.

Ron Lee

Reef Fish wrote:

> 1. I hold NO GRUDGE against anyone.

Liar.

>3. I do not shy from DEFENDING against from personal attacks, but
> as soon as the case is over, whether the mugger apologizes
> (extremely rare), or even just stop making unwarranted attacks
> and leave, it's OVER and DONE.

Liar

Bob Ling - aka - Large_Nassau_Grouper@Yahoo.com (Reef Fish) wrote:

> Pmcduffee (pmcduffee@aol.com) writes:
>
> > Reef take a grip....sometimes you, erm, just just loose it.



> It contains MANY consistent elements in my INTERNET practice:
>
> 1. I hold NO GRUDGE against anyone.
>
> 2. ACTION speaks louder than WORDS.



No matter the personal failings of the rest of the world...
....from this day and moment forward,



Wipe your own slate clean...
....and prove that claim.



-hh

Bob,

You are such a kidder. You pander to someone who comes into the NG like they
were your wet-nurse. They slap your wrists....saying bad Bob bad and you
lick their boots clean. What's with you. You are one very strange guy.

> Pat,
>
> You post infrequently, and not many folks know that I've known you
> in cyber space since the days you were a frequent participant in
> Scuba-L, in the early 1960s.

1960's? I had no idea? When was it you were certified Bob?

>
> I have ALWAYS held you in high regard, for all the reasons one would
> hold anyone in high regard, and I STILL DO, and WILL continue to do.

What a suck up....I guess you need to say this to lend credibility to
anything he posts (about you)???

>
> Which is why I felt the need (for YOU and the serious readers in this
> forum) to post a detailed reply to your succinct lines, so that
> you can understand what you apparently misunderstood, of the
> background in THIS thread, and related threads in which Ron Lee
> and Lee Bell participated, as well as the REASON I act as I do, to
> their posts (gratuitous and unjust attacks). (denial?)

We don't need Pat to post any lines about you Bob. We all read your dizzy
posts and we do understand just how on the edge you are. Many people....not
just Pat.....have petitioned for a more reasoned and moderate position by
you Bobbo.

>
> >
> > You do tend to let's, we say take a ride on the wild side.
>
> Yes, I am adventurous. ;<)
>

A cruising man....adventure on the high seas all right.

> >
> > You are very well versed in the debate, and you are always very factual.

Opinionated is more accurate.

>
> I thank you for your OBSERVATION, which I value as a compliment --
> THAT itself speaks a LOT, coming from you, because both
> Hugh Huntzinger and Lee Bell have been calling me LIAR on things
> factual I have posted. That's only ONE of the reasons I am not
> shy to defend myself, against such charges.

hahahah....Mommy, Mommy....he hit me.

>
>
> >
> > But sometimes you, erm, just just loose it.
>
> I understand what you mean, though you misspelled "lose".
> That's where a host of Mental Midgets climbed on Ron Lee, Lee Bell,
> and Hugh Huntzinger's lynching parties (or Feeesh BBQ as Hugh called
> it in ancient times). Frivolous attacks of my SPELLING -- by Ron
> Lee, who misspelled "misspell" and was oblivious to the irony of
> it, was the subthread in which you entered that led to this.
>

Wow.....who cares Bob? If you are concerned about this spelling thing, you
should have run a spell check on this post I'm responding to. So many
mistakes Bob. So many.

> >
> > Don't get so personal.
>
> This advice is appropriate on most occasions. Unfortunately, in
> the case of Ron Lee and Lee Bell -- the attacks are VERY PERSONAL,
> and in gratuitous ways -- against which I took pains to explain why
> they and their attacks were WRONG.
>

Bob...I'd take Pat's advise. You can't expect to come on to the NG yelling
and screaming, name calling and acting like a bully and expect people to sit
back and put up with it. People will respond. The bully always gets the poop
beat out of them in the end. You're behavior on the NG is pathetic. You
respond to a posters comments with rancor if they don't happen to agree with
your viewpoints. Your name calling is ugly and goes on and on. A bar of
soap....in the mouth...that's what you need. Pat...where are
you............you can hold him down.

>
> In Hugh Huntzinger's case, the attacks were even MORE personal than
> Ron Lee and Lee Bell's personal attacks. Hugh took pains to TWIST
> the content of my posts, fabricate LIES, and turned around to
> attack me on ths basis of his fabricated lies.
>

Bob....you shouldn't be stealing my observations about your clever
manipulation (well not so clever really) of NG history and applying them to
others. Hugh simply made observations about your behavior and posted them.
He only did this after you went on one of your manic "GRUDGE" posts. 1996?
I've noticed lately that you have been distorting the time line with the
start date of your SCUBA years Bob. I wonder if time is sort of a fluid
thing concept in your mind.

> Hugh's PERSONAL attack on me was based his own GRUDGE against ME,
> stated publicly in Scuba-L, and not disputed by him in rec.scuba,
> that he has held the same GRUDGE since 1996.

Paranoid?

>
> I tried SEVERAL times, in rec.scuba (documented) to conduct a
> discussion with him, in good faith, including complimenting his
> post on one occasion when I entered -- to no avail. Each time
> Hugh turned it into his own personal GRUDGE battle. The present
> threads on my Memorable Dive at Las Palmas, and the pix I posted
> about that dive started exactly that way.

And this is really misleading Bob. If a person doesn't happen to agree with
you....you call them some very unkind things. You do this to provoke them.
You are a bully. It's a shamed that you: 1. aren't as sharp as you might of
been once. 2. are so ill tempered and use such foul language. 3. show such
blatant disrespect to anyone that doesn't happen to "see it" like you do.

>
> I made a post. Hugh responded. I responded to Hugh in good faith,
> without the slightest rancor or the intention fo start or continue
> any old arguments we have had. Alas, on EACH of those two occasion,
> it was soon apparent that Hugh had NO INTENTION to do any
> ordinary discussion on the subject at all! He was there to
> find the excuses, the slightest ones, to manufacture FALSE
> STATEMENTS about what I said, and made flamewars out of them.
>

I believe he responded to your behavior Bob. A reasonable thing. And Hugh
has always given you a lot more rope than most people. He takes the time
tying to help you understand.

>
> It's ALL in the google archives of those threads. As I said in
> the original post of THIS thread, on what Bjorn posted, about
> Hugh, and me -- don't take Hugh's words or mine -- go READ the
> entire thread in the archives and judge it for YOURSELF.
>

It is ALL in the archives. Your rancor. Your nasty behavior. It's all there.
Hey I've got an idea. Why don't we gather up your achieved posts and send
them to the psychology department at Clemson. They could use these posts in
the classroom for analysis. Do you know any of the profs in Psychology? With
your permission, I bet they could report back to the group and let us know
exactly what we are up against.

>
> I have stated many times in the past that I hold NO GRUDGE against
> anyone, and I judge any post on a POST by POST basic, and I would
> AGREE or DISAGREE with anyone, friend of foe, on the substance of
> a post -- independent of past or present friendship or lack
> thereof.
>
> That's the way it is!

This in itself is a huge fib. You are such a card. You should have taught in
the marketing departement.

> This SHOULD be a clickable URL. If it's not, you can manually
> retrieve it in the "advanced groups search" of groups.google.com
> using AUTHOR = "reef fish" and search keywords "joel apology",
> as indicated in the URL below.
>
>
http://groups.google.com/groups?q=jo...son.edu&rnum=1
>
> It is a VERY LENGHY post, even by MY standards of length. But I
> know you'll not have any problem or complaint against length, and
> call all of my lengthy posts as rants -- which this one would
> surely qualify, in the eyes of my critics and flammers. (what is a
flammer?)
>
> It contains MANY consistent elements in my INTERNET practice:
>
> 1. I hold NO GRUDGE against anyone.
>
> 2. ACTION speaks louder than WORDS.
>
> 3. I do not shy from DEFENDING against from personal attacks, but
> as soon as the case is over, whether the mugger apologizes
> (extremely rare), or even just stop making unwarranted attacks
> and leave, it's OVER and DONE.
>
> 4. Joel DeRegla was an Aldora IDIOT, just as Ron Lee was. Joel and
> most other Aldora IDIOTs got over it, long time ago, when they
> finally understood my position about Aldora, which I stated in
> that post, as well as elsewhere. It's my CONSISTENT position,
> diametrically opposed to what Aldora IDIOTs say I do. Ron Lee
> is still singing the same old tune about "name calling" without
> regard to the SUBSTANCE behind such name-calling, which always
> ceases, as soon as the IDIOTS stop their idioting acts.
>

And of course, looking through these archives will also confirm that you are
mean spirited and twist the truth around and around. You invent a history
and then refer back to it with your rants.

> >
> > You are good, but lighten up just a tad.
> >
> > Jmhop,
> >
> > Pat
>
> Thanks, Pat. I hope after seeing this detailed reply to your
> well-intended and fairly put advise, you're in a much better position
> to understand what I say or do in the present rounds of 3-ring-
> flamewars in rec.scuba, complete with minor side-shows.
>
> -- Bob.
>
> Yes. I call you a Friend because you are a Friend. I like your
> sig, which did not show in your post when I took it to this reply
> mode.

I'm not so sure that Pat will appreciate this association with you. He is at
least sympathetic. He did send you words encouraging a more moderate
position. I'd take his advise. You might not run so many people off.

I really think you missed your calling. Marketing....that's your thing. Sell
it Bob...sell it.

Forest Aten

"Forest Aten" <forestaten@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:gvg8c.69514$JL2.959861@attbi_s03...
> Bob,
>
>
(snip)> > and Lee Bell participated, as well as the REASON I act as I do, to
> > their posts (gratuitous and unjust attacks). (denial?)
>
> We don't need Pat to post any lines about you Bob. We all read your dizzy
> posts

You read his dizzy posts?? And please don't speak for all of us in this
regard. I'm pretty darn sure that most of us don't read all of his dizzy
posts or even some of the somewhat less dizzy ones.

(snip)

"Forest Aten" <forestaten@comcast.net> wrote in message news:<gvg8c.69514$JL2.959861@attbi_s03>...


Rant and drivil by Forest Aten snipped


> > It's ALL in the google archives of those threads.


> > This SHOULD be a clickable URL. If it's not, you can manually
> > retrieve it in the "advanced groups search" of groups.google.com
> > using AUTHOR = "reef fish" and search keywords "joel apology",
> > as indicated in the URL below.
> >
> >
> http://groups.google.com/groups?q=jo...son.edu&rnum=1

> And of course, looking through these archives will also confirm that you are
> mean spirited and twist the truth around and around. You invent a history
> and then refer back to it with your rants.

You mean I twisted Joel's words? Joel's words are all HERE,
including as bonus the 3rd post in that thread:


http://groups.google.com/groups?q=ap...eos.net&rnum=1


> Forest Aten

Go back to peddling your travel business and your travel agent job!

-- Bob.

ronleenospam@pcisys.net (Ron Lee) wrote in message news:<4060f71c.5941688@news.pcisys.net>...
> >Reef Fish wrote:
>
> >> 1. I hold NO GRUDGE against anyone.

RF> All anyone has to do is to watch my ACTION in the trail of postings
RF> I've left behind (thousands in DejaNews), and will KNOW that I hold
RF> grudge against NO ONE. I treat all discussions/posters on a CASE
RF> by CASE basis. I have ZERO memory in terms of grudge.

RF> I have a very LONG memory (via DejaNews and my BHD <which most
RF> Scuba-L readers know <g>) for those who insist on returning to pull
RF> the Feesh's tail (I am Feesh, or Feeesh) over and over again.

That's YOU Ron Lee -- the only anal-retentive idiot, pushed by
his jihad, to keep returning for 8 or more years, to spew the SAME
myth that had been debunked completely, in the last Millennium! ;)

>
> But a dive shop in Cozumel (Aldora) led you on a years-long jihad
> against them and anyone who used them

That's Aldora IDIOT Ron Lee 8-year jihad. You obviously overlook
this in the same referenced post:

================= verbatim excerpt from referenced post

>and that you put me out of any
>discussion you may have regarding your dislikes for people that support
>Aldora, users that attack your integrity within this NG, and I will not
>intervine or meddle that you will be debating on with other users about
>Aldora and anything related them.

It NEEDS to be said that I DO NOT DISLIKE people who support Aldora!
Why SHOULD I?

That is a MYTH perpetrated by a few, the likes of Ron Lee, and the
VERY FEW I've labelled "Aldora IDIOTS", "Aldora Mental Midgets",
and "Aldora spammers". They are distinctly in the small minority
of those who prefer to dive with Aldora.

Actions speak louder than words.

You can comb the DejaNews archives on EVERYTHING I've ever posted
that has "Aldora" in it, and you will NOT find a single case
that supports the allegation that I 'dislike people who dive
with Aldora'. It's those very few who REFUSE TO REASON, and
refuse to look at facts, and refuse to listen that I post against
-- NOT because of 'Aldora', but because I would have done the same
if the name 'Aldora' had been replaced by the name of any other
shop in Cozumel or anywhere else in the world for that matter.

================== end Excerpt about Aldora from referenced post



> >> 2. ACTION speaks louder than WORDS.
>
> All I see from you is childish language.

Confucious say, "Wise man point to moon. Idiot see finger."



> Ron Lee

Your whining career is over. YOu have been thoroughly exposed for
what you are, and the jihad had been in you in the past 8 or more
years.

You are HISTORY, Ron.


NOW is you all flammer in THIS thread will excuse me, I'll be on
my way to a bridge tournament, followed by 10-day cruise to Tahiti.

I have much more enjoyable things to do that here clubbing IDIOT
heads.

Besides, Every that needs to be said has already been said
in the thread Ron Lee hijacked to this his new NOISE subject,
from what I posted in the thread:

Bjorn on Hugh Huntzinger and rec.scuba (5 articles)


-- Bob.

"Ron Lee" <ronleenospam@pcisys.net> wrote in message
news:40637c41.354305@news.pcisys.net...

> You apparently do not like Aldora for some reason. That is your
> choice but at least you do not use Aldora and Idiot to describe
> someone.

No I don't. I use Aldora Sucks to describe Aldora. People who throw their
money away there aren't necessarily idiots, just suckers.