Tank Explosion

"Dillon Pyron" <dmpyronINVALID@austin.rr.com> wrote in message
news:omqkg0hu7gtpa0uj6e5k1b4bff787tqh4f@4ax.com...
> Yeah, but it's too easy to blame the pilot and stop searching. For
> instance, is it really pilot error when a pilot accidentally puts a
> Mitsu Solitaire (I think that's the one) into reverse on one engine

Let me see ... Hmmmmm... Wonder, wonder, wonder .... Hmmmm.

It depends on where the plane is located. Over the U.S. it's everyone's
fault except the pilot. Outside the U.S. the pilot gets the blame because
his hand moved the controls.

How did I do on the test? If the question is answered correctly, I'm a
freaking genius. If the answer is wrong, you're a moron that posed an
unfair, double-meaning, unanswerable question.

"ben bradlee" <up2u2figr@NoWay.zip> wrote in message
news:iLGdndbbOL7VcZXc4p2dnA@centurytel.net...
>
> "BllFs6" <bllfs6@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:20040729080822.24921.00000431@mb-m20.aol.com...
> > Hi all...
> >
> > There was a tank explosion at a scuba/cave diving center down in central
> > Florida yesterday.
> >
> > One employee was killed and three divers injured.
> >
> > Seems the employee dropped an O2 tank, tank valve hit the ground, loud
> hiss for
> > a moment, then the tank ruptured/exploded.
> >
> > Now, in the past I can recall several instances of tanks blowing up due
to
> > being defective/mistreated (and I think even maybe being overfilled).
And
> I
> > seem to recall that some of the explosions were due to cracks that
formed
> in
> > the threaded neck then at some point they very rapidly enlarged causing
> the
> > tank to rupture, as opposed to a weak tank wall or defective material in
> > general.
> >
> > However, I dont recall any instances of an impact on a valve itself
> stressing
> > the neck enough to cause it to crack with inevitable following rupture.
> Does
> > anyone else here recall such a failure mode/incident ?
> >
> > But I do seem to recall an instance or 2 of valves getting knocked off
and
> > tanks turning into ballistic projectiles....
> >
> > Given this incident, if you havent been careful in handling your tanks
in
> the
> > past, you might want to reconsider.....
> >
> > And I know that if I ever put a serious "wack" on a tank valve, even if
it
> > doesnt rupture right then, it certainly could have started a crack and
the
> tank
> > and the valve are heading for the dumpster pronto....
> >
> > take care
> >
> > Blll
>
> If you are right about it being a tank of Oxygen, you should rethink the
> applicability to scuba and compressed air. An explosive event with O2 may

Ok, I've rethought it - its still applicable.

> just be hissing or gushing gas with air.
>
>

I'm more worried about the idiots on the road while driving to the dive site
than problems with my tanks.

Dennis


--
Thermonuclear War.
It's the -responsible- environmental alternative
Popeye

"Dennis (Icarus)" wrote

> I'm more worried about the idiots on the road while driving to the dive
site
> than problems with my tanks.

I'm particularly worried about them when I'm carrying tanks to a dive site.
I suspect that getting rear ended with 2 to 8 full tanks in the back of my
Durango might be spectacular.

Lee

"Lee Bell" <leebell@ix.remove.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:9cMOc.21084$iK.7097@newsread2.news.atl.earthl ink.net...
> "Dennis (Icarus)" wrote
>
> > I'm more worried about the idiots on the road while driving to the dive
> site
> > than problems with my tanks.
>
> I'm particularly worried about them when I'm carrying tanks to a dive
site.
> I suspect that getting rear ended with 2 to 8 full tanks in the back of my
> Durango might be spectacular.

I sincerely hope we never find out, Lee.

Dennis
>
> Lee
>
>

In article <76MOc.21079$iK.5094@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink. net>,
leebell@ix.remove.netcom.com says...
> I think this is highly unlikely. Anybody know what the flash point of
> aluminum in a high O2 environment is?

I don't know the flash point, but I could see it happen to aluminum
dust, but not something with the mass of a cylinder. Having been around
this sort of accident and having knowledge of several others involving
friends and acquaintances, I am pretty sure we're going to find that the
valve flashed. So far it's the only thing that makes sense. It was
either open, or cracked open when it hit the ground.

I had a valve blow apart when I accidentally opened a 2500 PSI O2 whip
into it when it was closed. The valve stayed on the cylinder, but the
stem gland was blown out and everything inside was burned. The whip was
completely burned. The seat burned up and let all of the gas (only about
300 PSI)out of the cylinder. I had the imprint of the end of a Sherwood
valve handle in the palm of my left hand for a week. This was inside a
dive shop, and we found most of the pieces. After this incident, I
stopped running O2 through the Haskel.

The accident at Rennaker's was outside, and it is possible that the
pieces will never be found.

"Al Wells" <fossuldiver@seatypsy.us> wrote in message
news:MPG.1b7582bd8a7a63089896e9@news.verizon.net.. .
> In article <76MOc.21079$iK.5094@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink. net>,
> leebell@ix.remove.netcom.com says...
> > I think this is highly unlikely. Anybody know what the flash point of
> > aluminum in a high O2 environment is?
>
> I don't know the flash point, but I could see it happen to aluminum
> dust, but not something with the mass of a cylinder. Having been around
> this sort of accident and having knowledge of several others involving
> friends and acquaintances, I am pretty sure we're going to find that the
> valve flashed. So far it's the only thing that makes sense. It was
> either open, or cracked open when it hit the ground.
>
> I had a valve blow apart when I accidentally opened a 2500 PSI O2 whip
> into it when it was closed. The valve stayed on the cylinder, but the
> stem gland was blown out and everything inside was burned. The whip was
> completely burned. The seat burned up and let all of the gas (only about
> 300 PSI)out of the cylinder. I had the imprint of the end of a Sherwood
> valve handle in the palm of my left hand for a week. This was inside a
> dive shop, and we found most of the pieces. After this incident, I
> stopped running O2 through the Haskel.

Haskel boosters should never be used for O2. As an engineer, I am sure you
understand why.

This is the bee's knee's: http://masterlineinc.com/products/booster.htm

> The accident at Rennaker's was outside, and it is possible that the
> pieces will never be found.

The whole thing is such a drag. I hope that the facts will come out soon.

Lee Bell wrote:
> "Dennis (Icarus)" wrote
>
>
>>I'm more worried about the idiots on the road while driving to the dive
>
> site
>
>>than problems with my tanks.
>
>
> I'm particularly worried about them when I'm carrying tanks to a dive site.
> I suspect that getting rear ended with 2 to 8 full tanks in the back of my
> Durango might be spectacular.
>
> Lee
>
>
Mine lie horizontally in the trunk or the pick up. Probably doesn't
matter which way they point since they would be in a process of moving
during impact. But, just in case they don't, I think I'll point them at
the @$$%*~! that is going to rear end me.

BllFs6 wrote:
>>Without intending disrespect for the dead and injured,
>>I suspect that liability issues may cause the details to be kept quiet.
>>
>
>
> Yeah....
>
> thats about one of the worst things about our legal system.....that the key
> facts can be kept secret in any settlement.....
>
> Great for the winner or "settles" but a royal big one up the rear for anyone
> else who gets bit because some info was kept secret....
>

Sadly, true. I was reminded of the explosion and resulting
fatality in Tobermory back in 2000. One is usually told "wait and the
facts will come out", but said "facts" are often veiled from the public
view. This is a link to one of the original stories.
Tobermory tank explosion (a surplus torpedo charging air tank, not your
typical back tank)
http://makeashorterlink.com/?M2FB11DE8

Months after that explosion, the MD who was Coroner for the Province of
Ontario was warned not to do a Power Point presentation he had prepared
for a chapter of the Hyperbaric Medical Society by the legal types.
Disturbing to know the answers are often known but not admissible in
public, though in this particular example one could probably guess the
cause.
Bombs not Bugs (remember Y-2K?)
http://www.uhms-glc.ca/glc21rpt.html

In article <y7ROc.2422$Hu2.371@tornado.tampabay.rr.com>, greatviz
<greatviz@netscapeNOTSPAM.net> wrote:

€ Months after that explosion, the MD who was Coroner for the Province of
€ Ontario was warned not to do a Power Point presentation he had prepared
€ for a chapter of the Hyperbaric Medical Society by the legal types.
€ Disturbing to know the answers are often known but not admissible in
€ public, though in this particular example one could probably guess the
€ cause.

Cite?

--
"We're going to rush the hijackers."
-Jeremy Glick, aboard United Airlines flight 93, September 11, 2001

In article <MPG.1b7582bd8a7a63089896e9@news.verizon.net>,
Al Wells <fossuldiver@seatypsy.us> wrote:
>
>
>In article <76MOc.21079$iK.5094@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink. net>,
>leebell@ix.remove.netcom.com says...
>> I think this is highly unlikely. Anybody know what the flash point of
>> aluminum in a high O2 environment is?
>
>I don't know the flash point, but I could see it happen to aluminum
>dust, but not something with the mass of a cylinder. Having been around
>this sort of accident and having knowledge of several others involving
>friends and acquaintances, I am pretty sure we're going to find that the
>valve flashed. So far it's the only thing that makes sense. It was
>either open, or cracked open when it hit the ground.
>
>I had a valve blow apart when I accidentally opened a 2500 PSI O2 whip
>into it when it was closed. The valve stayed on the cylinder, but the
>stem gland was blown out and everything inside was burned. The whip was
>completely burned. The seat burned up and let all of the gas (only about
>300 PSI)out of the cylinder. I had the imprint of the end of a Sherwood
>valve handle in the palm of my left hand for a week. This was inside a
>dive shop, and we found most of the pieces. After this incident, I
>stopped running O2 through the Haskel.
>
>The accident at Rennaker's was outside, and it is possible that the
>pieces will never be found.

The fill whip at Rennakers was closed post-incident and had 2500 psi
(according to the gauge on it) after this happened.

Fran could not have opened the fill valve into a closed cylinder
valve, otherwise the fill valve would have been OPEN.

--
--
Karl Denninger (karl@denninger.net) Internet Consultant & Kids Rights Activist
http://www.denninger.net My home on the net
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