Back Inflation and GO Diving

There was a discussion a while back on wing type and back inflation types of
buoyancy compensators. Here is something new.

Yesterday I used a wetsuit, BP/W, and 16# of lead. The dive plan was to
swim a few hundred yards and sit on the bottom and pull weeds. Sixteen
pounds of lead puts me in the grossly overweighted (GO) category. The first
thing I noticed - besides that it takes a whole crapper full of air to lift
the extra 10 to 12 pounds of weight - is that it was not possible to sit
upright on the bottom of the lake with the bladder capacity at neutral
buoyancy. The wing pushed my head down so as to be parallel with the earth.
On the surface it was the same. All this leads me to conclude that one
could drown rather easily with this type of equipment given the right
circumstances.

"ben bradlee" <NoWay@Way.Bite.Me> wrote in message
news:MfmdnTe4-ICvV0zbnZ2dnUVZ_gidnZ2d@centurytel.net...
> There was a discussion a while back on wing type and back inflation types
> of buoyancy compensators. Here is something new.
>
> Yesterday I used a wetsuit, BP/W, and 16# of lead. The dive plan was to
> swim a few hundred yards and sit on the bottom and pull weeds. Sixteen
> pounds of lead puts me in the grossly overweighted (GO) category. The
> first thing I noticed - besides that it takes a whole crapper full of air
> to lift the extra 10 to 12 pounds of weight - is that it was not possible
> to sit upright on the bottom of the lake with the bladder capacity at
> neutral buoyancy. The wing pushed my head down so as to be parallel with
> the earth. On the surface it was the same. All this leads me to conclude
> that one could drown rather easily with this type of equipment given the
> right circumstances.


If you want a lifejacket, get one.

The BC or BP/W that holds you, correctly, horizontal, while diving, is the
superior design.

Are you really -that- far behind on trim paradigms?

Next time, try a steel tank, and the correct amount of weight.

That makes your surface time more manageable.

Why you can't sit down, while "GO", with no air in your flotation device
(or why that would be a question anyway), is anybody's guess.

And I hate to give you this Page 1 flash, Einstein, but one can -always-
drown rather easily when on, or under, water.

"ben bradlee" <NoWay@Way.Bite.Me> wrote in message
news:MfmdnTe4-ICvV0zbnZ2dnUVZ_gidnZ2d@centurytel.net...
> There was a discussion a while back on wing type and back inflation types
> of buoyancy compensators. Here is something new.
>
> Yesterday I used a wetsuit, BP/W, and 16# of lead. The dive plan was to
> swim a few hundred yards and sit on the bottom and pull weeds. Sixteen
> pounds of lead puts me in the grossly overweighted (GO) category. The
> first thing I noticed - besides that it takes a whole crapper full of air
> to lift the extra 10 to 12 pounds of weight - is that it was not possible
> to sit upright on the bottom of the lake with the bladder capacity at
> neutral buoyancy. The wing pushed my head down so as to be parallel with
> the earth. On the surface it was the same. All this leads me to conclude
> that one could drown rather easily with this type of equipment given the
> right circumstances.

You don't suppose the location of the 16 lbs might have had something to do
with it?

Douglas W. "Popeye" Frederick wrote

> If you want a lifejacket, get one.
>
> The BC or BP/W that holds you, correctly, horizontal, while diving, is the
> superior design.

Right idea, poorly stated. A plate does not "hold" you horizontal, it merely
allows you to remain that way with little or no effort.

Correctly trimmed, it does not push you face down while underwater or on the
surface.

Lee

"Douglas W. "Popeye" Frederick" <Popeye@finalprotectivefire.com> wrote in
message news:13d3vh6ersc812c@news.supernews.com...
> "ben bradlee" <NoWay@Way.Bite.Me> wrote in message
> news:MfmdnTe4-ICvV0zbnZ2dnUVZ_gidnZ2d@centurytel.net...
> > There was a discussion a while back on wing type and back inflation
types
> > of buoyancy compensators. Here is something new.
> >
> > Yesterday I used a wetsuit, BP/W, and 16# of lead. The dive plan was to
> > swim a few hundred yards and sit on the bottom and pull weeds. Sixteen
> > pounds of lead puts me in the grossly overweighted (GO) category. The
> > first thing I noticed - besides that it takes a whole crapper full of
air
> > to lift the extra 10 to 12 pounds of weight - is that it was not
possible
> > to sit upright on the bottom of the lake with the bladder capacity at
> > neutral buoyancy. The wing pushed my head down so as to be parallel
with
> > the earth. On the surface it was the same. All this leads me to
conclude
> > that one could drown rather easily with this type of equipment given the
> > right circumstances.
>
>
> If you want a lifejacket, get one.
>
> The BC or BP/W that holds you, correctly, horizontal, while diving, is
the
> superior design.

I tell ya, even fully inflated, my wing has NEVER "pushed my head down"
while I was at the surface.

>
> Are you really -that- far behind on trim paradigms?
>
> Next time, try a steel tank, and the correct amount of weight.
>
> That makes your surface time more manageable.
>
> Why you can't sit down, while "GO", with no air in your flotation device
> (or why that would be a question anyway), is anybody's guess.

I take it he had some air in the BC. which may be why he had to be
overweighted?

But if your goal is to pull weeds...wouldn;t being horizontal, floating hst
a bit above the bottom..make that easier?

>
> And I hate to give you this Page 1 flash, Einstein, but one can -always-
> drown rather easily when on, or under, water.
>

Dennis

"ben bradlee" <NoWay@Way.Bite.Me> wrote in message
news:MfmdnTe4-ICvV0zbnZ2dnUVZ_gidnZ2d@centurytel.net...
> There was a discussion a while back on wing type and back inflation types
of
> buoyancy compensators. Here is something new.
>
> Yesterday I used a wetsuit, BP/W, and 16# of lead. The dive plan was to
> swim a few hundred yards and sit on the bottom and pull weeds. Sixteen
> pounds of lead puts me in the grossly overweighted (GO) category. The
first
> thing I noticed - besides that it takes a whole crapper full of air to
lift
> the extra 10 to 12 pounds of weight - is that it was not possible to sit
> upright on the bottom of the lake with the bladder capacity at neutral
> buoyancy. The wing pushed my head down so as to be parallel with the
earth.
> On the surface it was the same. All this leads me to conclude that one
> could drown rather easily with this type of equipment given the right
> circumstances.

How patently obsurd.

On Aug 26, 2:07 pm, "ben bradlee" <No...@Way.Bite.Me> wrote:
> There was a discussion a while back on wing type and back inflation types of
> buoyancy compensators. Here is something new.
>
> Yesterday I used a wetsuit, BP/W, and 16# of lead. The dive plan was to
> swim a few hundred yards and sit on the bottom and pull weeds. Sixteen
> pounds of lead puts me in the grossly overweighted (GO) category.

You are grossly overweighted in a wet suit with 16 lbs ? You don't
mention if this is salt or fresh water but since you are "pulling
weeds', I'm assuming it's fresh water.

> The first
> thing I noticed - besides that it takes a whole crapper full of air to lift
> the extra 10 to 12 pounds of weight - is that it was not possible to sit
> upright on the bottom of the lake with the bladder capacity at neutral
> buoyancy.

The extra 10 to 12 pounds of weight ? Are you saying that you
normally would use 4 to 6 lbs of weight with a wetsuit ?

> The wing pushed my head down so as to be parallel with the earth.
> On the surface it was the same. All this leads me to conclude that one
> could drown rather easily with this type of equipment given the right
> circumstances.

I'm really confused on this : "The wing pushed my head down so as to
be parallel with the earth." If you had all of the air out your
back floatation BC, it would not push you anywhere.

<hierophantfish@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1188196220.829670.191880@w3g2000hsg.googlegro ups.com...
> On Aug 26, 2:07 pm, "ben bradlee" <No...@Way.Bite.Me> wrote:
>> There was a discussion a while back on wing type and back inflation types
>> of
>> buoyancy compensators. Here is something new.
>>
>> Yesterday I used a wetsuit, BP/W, and 16# of lead. The dive plan was to
>> swim a few hundred yards and sit on the bottom and pull weeds. Sixteen
>> pounds of lead puts me in the grossly overweighted (GO) category.
>
> You are grossly overweighted in a wet suit with 16 lbs ? You don't
> mention if this is salt or fresh water but since you are "pulling
> weeds', I'm assuming it's fresh water.

He was overweighting himself to work on the bottom.

He's a skinny little runt.

>> The first
>> thing I noticed - besides that it takes a whole crapper full of air to
>> lift
>> the extra 10 to 12 pounds of weight - is that it was not possible to sit
>> upright on the bottom of the lake with the bladder capacity at neutral
>> buoyancy.
>
> The extra 10 to 12 pounds of weight ? Are you saying that you
> normally would use 4 to 6 lbs of weight with a wetsuit ?
>
>> The wing pushed my head down so as to be parallel with the earth.
>> On the surface it was the same. All this leads me to conclude that one
>> could drown rather easily with this type of equipment given the right
>> circumstances.
>
> I'm really confused on this : "The wing pushed my head down so as to
> be parallel with the earth." If you had all of the air out your
> back floatation BC, it would not push you anywhere.
>

"ben bradlee" <NoWay@Way.Bite.Me> wrote in message
news:MfmdnTe4-ICvV0zbnZ2dnUVZ_gidnZ2d@centurytel.net...
> There was a discussion a while back on wing type and back inflation types of
> buoyancy compensators. Here is something new.
>
> Yesterday I used a wetsuit, BP/W, and 16# of lead. The dive plan was to swim a few
> hundred yards and sit on the bottom and pull weeds. Sixteen pounds of lead puts me
> in the grossly overweighted (GO) category. The first thing I noticed - besides
> that it takes a whole crapper full of air to lift the extra 10 to 12 pounds of
> weight - is that it was not possible to sit upright on the bottom of the lake with
> the bladder capacity at neutral buoyancy. The wing pushed my head down so as to be
> parallel with the earth. On the surface it was the same. All this leads me to
> conclude that one could drown rather easily with this type of equipment given the
> right circumstances.

Sounds like you were overweighted. If you did this to work on the bottom then you
should just deflate the BC and you can walk around the bottom. You can also adjust
trim by moving the weight farther back toward the wing.

Adam

"Douglas W. \"Popeye\" Frederick" <Pop...@finalprotectivefire.com>
wrote:
>
> If you want a lifejacket, get one.

Thats what the old horsecollars were


> The BC or BP/W that holds you, correctly, horizontal, while diving, is the
> superior design.


This assumes that one's definition of "correct" is that it equals
horizontal.


Particularly for UW photo, my definition of correct is that the BC
does not impede me from attaining any orientation while diving.

Plus, it would be nice if it could do double duty on the surface as a
'life jacket' for those instances where the surface float doesn't go
according to plan (see the current month's issue of Alert Diver for an
example), or at least not be a bad face-dunker. Particuarly when
using rental AL80's at some remote resort because they don't have any
Steels.


-hh