Earth Hour

On Mar 30, 1:58*pm, Grumman-581 <grumman581-usenet-2...@spambob.net>
wrote:
> On Sun, 30 Mar 2008 08:11:16 -0700, JOF wrote:
> > Our house is only about 1500 feet.
>
> What some people might fail to realize though is that 1500 sq-ft up there
> is not the same as 1500 sq-ft down here... Up there, a house is likely to
> have a basement under the entire 1500 sq-ft living area in addition to
> possibly even under an attached garage and that does not count in the
> living space of the house when it is sold...

That's true. My toyroom is in the basement, where I sit as I type
this.

JF

On Sun, 30 Mar 2008 11:30:40 -0700, JOF wrote:

> That's true. My toyroom is in the basement, where I sit as I type this.

Whereas around here, we're more likely to convert a 3rd and 4th bedroom
into offices... We might have game rooms for pool tables or as a media
room whereas you are likely to have it in your basement and thus not count
towards the 1500 sq-ft of your living space... Formal dining rooms
are often converted into offices around here also if the family is
not really a formal dining type of family and tend to just eat all
meals in the breakfast area adjoining the kitchen... Around here, our
utility/laundry room with our washer, dryer, sink, and cabinets are in our
living area, whereas you are more likely to have it in your basement and
as such not count towards your living space... The cost per sq-ft of
living space tends to be higher up there due to this 'hidden' space that
doesn't get counted in the basements... Around here, 1500 sq-ft would be
considered a rather small house, but if you can factor in another 1500+
sq-ft of basement, it makes it into a nice sized house... If your basement
extends underneath a 2-car garage, then instead of being 1500 sq-ft, it's
probably over 1900 sq-ft and we're thus talking about 3400 sq-ft of space
to work with even though you *officially* have only a 1500 sq-ft house...

--
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On Sun, 30 Mar 2008 10:21:11 -0800, "Scott"
<pugetsounddiver@gmail.com> wrote:


I just got done doing my bit for earth hour, I drove 3 hours in my V8
4runner, looked at and inspected a 10 meter Trojan Sedan and put in a
bid on it. Should burn 20 to 30 gallona per hour cruising and up to 50
per wide open.

On Mar 30, 3:01*pm, Grumman-581 <grumman581-usenet-2...@spambob.net>
wrote:
> On Sun, 30 Mar 2008 11:30:40 -0700, JOF wrote:
> > That's true. My toyroom is in the basement, where I sit as I type this.
>
> Whereas around here, we're more likely to convert a 3rd and 4th bedroom
> into offices... We might have game rooms for pool tables or as a media
> room whereas you are likely to have it in your basement and thus not count
> towards the 1500 sq-ft of your living space... Formal dining rooms
> are often converted into offices around here also if the family is
> not really a formal dining type of family and tend to just eat all
> meals in the breakfast area adjoining the kitchen... Around here, our
> utility/laundry room with our washer, dryer, sink, and cabinets are in our
> living area, whereas you are more likely to have it in your basement and
> as such not count towards your living space... The cost per sq-ft of
> living space tends to be higher up there due to this 'hidden' space that
> doesn't get counted in the basements... Around here, 1500 sq-ft would be
> considered a rather small house, but if you can factor in another 1500+
> sq-ft of basement, it makes it into a nice sized house... If your basement
> extends underneath a 2-car garage, then instead of being 1500 sq-ft, it's
> probably over 1900 sq-ft and we're thus talking about 3400 sq-ft of space
> to work with even though you *officially* have only a 1500 sq-ft house...

Not quite that big. The basement doesn't extend under the garage and
in fact because it's a split level a small part of the basement has a
lower ceiling height making it only good for storage space. It's
really quite a modest house. We've talked about building over the
years but with just the two of us here now we've got all the space we
need. If we build a new place it won't be any bigger than what we have
already.

JF

On Sun, 30 Mar 2008 14:16:25 -0700 (PDT), JOF <jofrancis@gmail.com>
wrote:

>If we build a new place it won't be any bigger than what we have
>already.

What? Build a new place? With all those trees sacrificed for the wood
to make it? How anti-green can you be?
How about all those petrochemicals to make the new shingles for the
new place not to mention all the new furniture, plywood and
formaldehyde gas it will emit for the next 20 years? Make sure you
double insulated and hyper seal it to keep the formaldehyde inside.
But be sure to turn off the lights so you don't consume too much
energy. :)

On Mar 30, 5:59*pm, Geoff <ge...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> On Sun, 30 Mar 2008 14:16:25 -0700 (PDT), JOF <jofran...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >If we build a new place it won't be any bigger than what we have
> >already.
>
> What? Build a new place? With all those trees sacrificed for the wood
> to make it? How anti-green can you be?
> How about all those petrochemicals to make the new shingles for the
> new place not to mention all the new furniture, plywood and
> formaldehyde gas it will emit for the next 20 years? Make sure you
> double insulated and hyper seal it to keep the formaldehyde inside.
> But be sure to turn off the lights so you don't consume too much
> energy. :)

We're into steel studs up here now although the trusses are generally
still wood. It's either build new or replace the roof on the old
Where's the saving there? We use air exchangers here now to try to
abate the toxin containment. Some of our new houses are smart houses
that automagically control things like lights and heat. Not sure if
I'd go to that extent or not.

Hey, you're probably right about avoiding the token gestures. Why
encourage folks to be environmentally responsible when for the
majority it will only be a token gesture? The earth is probably
destined for breakdown anyway so why delay the inevitable, right?

JF

JOF wrote:
> On Mar 30, 5:59 pm, Geoff <ge...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 30 Mar 2008 14:16:25 -0700 (PDT), JOF <jofran...@gmail.com>
>>wrote:
>>
>>
>>>If we build a new place it won't be any bigger than what we have
>>>already.
>>
>>What? Build a new place? With all those trees sacrificed for the wood
>>to make it? How anti-green can you be?
>>How about all those petrochemicals to make the new shingles for the
>>new place not to mention all the new furniture, plywood and
>>formaldehyde gas it will emit for the next 20 years? Make sure you
>>double insulated and hyper seal it to keep the formaldehyde inside.
>>But be sure to turn off the lights so you don't consume too much
>>energy. :)
>
>
> We're into steel studs up here now although the trusses are generally
> still wood. It's either build new or replace the roof on the old
> Where's the saving there? We use air exchangers here now to try to
> abate the toxin containment. Some of our new houses are smart houses
> that automagically control things like lights and heat. Not sure if
> I'd go to that extent or not.
>
> Hey, you're probably right about avoiding the token gestures. Why
> encourage folks to be environmentally responsible when for the
> majority it will only be a token gesture? The earth is probably
> destined for breakdown anyway so why delay the inevitable, right?
>
> JF

TOken gestures are just that, tokens. THey have no real effect to change
people's lifestyles. It just makes them feel good.

And that's what you folks are all about, isn't it?

--
“TANSTAAFL”
__________________________________________________ __________________________

America: Ironically, the safest place to be anti-American.
__________________________________________________ __________________________
"A prudent man foresees the difficulties ahead and prepares for them;
the simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences." - Proverbs 22:3

"dazed and confuzzed" <dedmann@comcast_remove.net> wrote in message
news:s-idnSQCYoM2gm3anZ2dnUVZ_uidnZ2d@comcast.com...
> JOF wrote:
>> On Mar 30, 5:59 pm, Geoff <ge...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>>On Sun, 30 Mar 2008 14:16:25 -0700 (PDT), JOF <jofran...@gmail.com>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>If we build a new place it won't be any bigger than what we have
>>>>already.
>>>
>>>What? Build a new place? With all those trees sacrificed for the wood
>>>to make it? How anti-green can you be?
>>>How about all those petrochemicals to make the new shingles for the
>>>new place not to mention all the new furniture, plywood and
>>>formaldehyde gas it will emit for the next 20 years? Make sure you
>>>double insulated and hyper seal it to keep the formaldehyde inside.
>>>But be sure to turn off the lights so you don't consume too much
>>>energy. :)
>>
>>
>> We're into steel studs up here now although the trusses are generally
>> still wood. It's either build new or replace the roof on the old
>> Where's the saving there? We use air exchangers here now to try to
>> abate the toxin containment. Some of our new houses are smart houses
>> that automagically control things like lights and heat. Not sure if
>> I'd go to that extent or not.
>>
>> Hey, you're probably right about avoiding the token gestures. Why
>> encourage folks to be environmentally responsible when for the
>> majority it will only be a token gesture? The earth is probably
>> destined for breakdown anyway so why delay the inevitable, right?
>>
>> JF
>
> TOken gestures are just that, tokens. THey have no real effect to change
> people's lifestyles. It just makes them feel good.
>
> And that's what you folks are all about, isn't it?

you've got a problem with feeling good?

On Sun, 30 Mar 2008 14:16:25 -0700, JOF wrote:

> Not quite that big. The basement doesn't extend under the garage and in
> fact because it's a split level a small part of the basement has a lower
> ceiling height making it only good for storage space. It's really quite a
> modest house. We've talked about building over the years but with just the
> two of us here now we've got all the space we need. If we build a new
> place it won't be any bigger than what we have already.

Up there in those areas where it gets cold, you have to have the footing
for your house below the frost line... When you already have to put them
that deep, it doesn't cost that much more in the grand scheme of things to
go a bit deeper and end up with a basement out of the deal... That's why
we don't tend to see basements down here -- there is no frost line to
speak of... What's your temperature today? It was a balmy 80F around here...

You don't tend to see many split level houses around here... That's
probably because of 2 reasons...

1 -- We don't have enough varying terrain that a split level would be
appropriate for...

2 -- Split level houses require more design with respect to the contours
of the existing lot's terrain elevations and that means that the builders
can't just build every house in the subdivision like every other house int
he subdivision... The damned 'master planned communities' that we have
around here are an architectual disgrace... Whoever came up with that idea
should have been killed at birth...

--
See NNTP header field "X-Real-Email-Address" to reply by email.

dechucka wrote:

> "dazed and confuzzed" <dedmann@comcast_remove.net> wrote in message
> news:s-idnSQCYoM2gm3anZ2dnUVZ_uidnZ2d@comcast.com...
>
>>JOF wrote:
>>
>>>On Mar 30, 5:59 pm, Geoff <ge...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>On Sun, 30 Mar 2008 14:16:25 -0700 (PDT), JOF <jofran...@gmail.com>
>>>>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>If we build a new place it won't be any bigger than what we have
>>>>>already.
>>>>
>>>>What? Build a new place? With all those trees sacrificed for the wood
>>>>to make it? How anti-green can you be?
>>>>How about all those petrochemicals to make the new shingles for the
>>>>new place not to mention all the new furniture, plywood and
>>>>formaldehyde gas it will emit for the next 20 years? Make sure you
>>>>double insulated and hyper seal it to keep the formaldehyde inside.
>>>>But be sure to turn off the lights so you don't consume too much
>>>>energy. :)
>>>
>>>
>>>We're into steel studs up here now although the trusses are generally
>>>still wood. It's either build new or replace the roof on the old
>>>Where's the saving there? We use air exchangers here now to try to
>>>abate the toxin containment. Some of our new houses are smart houses
>>>that automagically control things like lights and heat. Not sure if
>>>I'd go to that extent or not.
>>>
>>>Hey, you're probably right about avoiding the token gestures. Why
>>>encourage folks to be environmentally responsible when for the
>>>majority it will only be a token gesture? The earth is probably
>>>destined for breakdown anyway so why delay the inevitable, right?
>>>
>>>JF
>>
>>TOken gestures are just that, tokens. THey have no real effect to change
>>people's lifestyles. It just makes them feel good.
>>
>>And that's what you folks are all about, isn't it?
>
>
> you've got a problem with feeling good?
>
>

I do when the gesture that makes you feel good for doing something is
empty and meaningless.

If these folks actually did something that required some lifestyle
change, then they wouldn't be token gestures. If the gestures resulted
in some meaningful change they wouldn't be meaningless "token" gestures.

But generally no one is willing to be inconvenienced to make any changes.

--
“TANSTAAFL”
__________________________________________________ __________________________

America: Ironically, the safest place to be anti-American.
__________________________________________________ __________________________
"A prudent man foresees the difficulties ahead and prepares for them;
the simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences." - Proverbs 22:3