So, I got my OW Cert

Well, I passed my open water last night. I and two other guys did our
lake dives on Monday and Tuesday evening. I discovered one thing that
I feared I might. I'm probably going to have to get a custom made
wetsuit. I used an XXL Farmer John that was very tight (in the thigh
and in the upper arms as well as the chest) and also, very long. My
knee pads were really shin pads and the sleeves on my suit were an
extra 3-4 inches too long. BTW, I'm 5'9" and 228 pounds at about 18%
bodyfat right now. So, anyone able to recommend a good wetsuit
company that custom makes a wetsuit inexpensively? Or, should I have
my own gal (I'm a powerlifter and my team has a gal that custom fits
some of our suits. One of my training partners has even squatted 700
pounds in a suit that she has tailored and it didn't blow out.) do
that with an off the rack suit? I think it would be better get a
custom from a shop that does this on a regular basis.

One other thing worth mentioning, the smallest guy there had the most
trouble (I had none, thank you very much) on the last night's dives.
He started his emergency ascent without his regulator and he had to
put that back in. He had to do his navigation twice because he fucked
up as well as a couple of other minor issues. At the end of the
dives, he had by far, the most amount of air left. The next guy was
the tall, medium sized guy and last but not least, there was I, the
heavily muscled powerlifter with the least amount of air.

"John Hanson" wrote

> Well, I passed my open water last night. I and two other guys did our
> lake dives on Monday and Tuesday evening.

Congratulations. Welcome to the ranks of certified divers.

> I discovered one thing that I feared I might. I'm probably going to have
> to get a custom made wetsuit.

Many people do.

> So, anyone able to recommend a good wetsuit company that custom makes a
> wetsuit inexpensively?

Unfortunately, inexpensive and diving are not terms often found together.
You'll have to shop around. The best advise I can offer is to try to go to
the shop to be measured. Chances of someone with a powerlifter's build
finding someone who can build a suit correctly for them without more than
the normal few measurements seem to high to take the chance. If you are
occasionally in South Florida, there's a custom wetsuit shop in Hollywood.

I don't know where you are diving, but if you expect to be doing relatively
long dives in water cold enough to need thermal protection, don't fail to
consider a drysuit. They're expensive as all getout, but if you buy the
right one, are usable in a wider range of temperatures than a wetsuit.

> One other thing worth mentioning, the smallest guy there had the most
> trouble (I had none, thank you very much) on the last night's dives.

Nobody said that small guys are automatically better, or worse divers.

> He started his emergency ascent without his regulator and he had to put
> that back in. He had to do his navigation twice because
> he fucked up as well as a couple of other minor issues.

Did he pass too? If so, you might want to consider how much reliance to put
in the advice, on consumption or anything else, of the instructor that
signed his card.

Lee

On Wed, 24 May 2006 23:32:45 -0400, "Lee Bell"
<pleebell2@bellsouth.net> wrote in rec.scuba:

>"John Hanson" wrote
>
>> Well, I passed my open water last night. I and two other guys did our
>> lake dives on Monday and Tuesday evening.
>
>Congratulations. Welcome to the ranks of certified divers.
>
>> I discovered one thing that I feared I might. I'm probably going to have
>> to get a custom made wetsuit.
>
>Many people do.
>
>> So, anyone able to recommend a good wetsuit company that custom makes a
>> wetsuit inexpensively?
>
>Unfortunately, inexpensive and diving are not terms often found together.
>You'll have to shop around. The best advise I can offer is to try to go to
>the shop to be measured. Chances of someone with a powerlifter's build
>finding someone who can build a suit correctly for them without more than
>the normal few measurements seem to high to take the chance. If you are
>occasionally in South Florida, there's a custom wetsuit shop in Hollywood.
>
>I don't know where you are diving, but if you expect to be doing relatively
>long dives in water cold enough to need thermal protection, don't fail to
>consider a drysuit. They're expensive as all getout, but if you buy the
>right one, are usable in a wider range of temperatures than a wetsuit.
>
>> One other thing worth mentioning, the smallest guy there had the most
>> trouble (I had none, thank you very much) on the last night's dives.
>
>Nobody said that small guys are automatically better, or worse divers.
>
>> He started his emergency ascent without his regulator and he had to put
>> that back in. He had to do his navigation twice because
>> he fucked up as well as a couple of other minor issues.
>
>Did he pass too? If so, you might want to consider how much reliance to put
>in the advice, on consumption or anything else, of the instructor that
>signed his card.
>
Yes, he did pass. But, he was made to complete his skills. He also
had done his initial training a few months ago. But, being the
technician I am, I have no doubt from my observation that muscle mass
is indeed the biggest factor in the amount of air consumed. Keep in
mind that if I quit my powerlifting training, I would waste away to
about half the amount of muscle mass I have presently, perhaps more.

It takes a massive amount of energy to fuel a powerlifter who trains 4
days/week. This is a good thing. I can eat and drink whatever I
want. 18% bodyfat isn't going to get me on the cover of any magazine
either but it is probably less than most Americans over the age of 40.
My point is Lee, that even though you've been diving for years, you
have probably only experienced diving mostly with people who fit
comfortably inside the bell curve as far as America in general. Muscle
mass doesn't vary much among them. It does with us folks on the
extreme ends of the bell. Perhaps you've given too much credence to
ones comfortability is in the water. Just for the fuck of it, what
are your vital statistics? Height, weight, bodyfat %, age, etc.?

"John Hanson" <jhanson@northernlinks.com> wrote in message
news:5k9a72do7pqhuceij7lqtkog4lgpd9l87q@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 24 May 2006 23:32:45 -0400, "Lee Bell"
> <pleebell2@bellsouth.net> wrote in rec.scuba:
>
> >"John Hanson" wrote
> >
> >> Well, I passed my open water last night. I and two other guys did our
> >> lake dives on Monday and Tuesday evening.
> >
> >Congratulations. Welcome to the ranks of certified divers.
> >
> >> I discovered one thing that I feared I might. I'm probably going to
have
> >> to get a custom made wetsuit.
> >
> >Many people do.
> >
> >> So, anyone able to recommend a good wetsuit company that custom makes a
> >> wetsuit inexpensively?
> >
> >Unfortunately, inexpensive and diving are not terms often found together.
> >You'll have to shop around. The best advise I can offer is to try to go
to
> >the shop to be measured. Chances of someone with a powerlifter's build
> >finding someone who can build a suit correctly for them without more than
> >the normal few measurements seem to high to take the chance. If you are
> >occasionally in South Florida, there's a custom wetsuit shop in
Hollywood.
> >
> >I don't know where you are diving, but if you expect to be doing
relatively
> >long dives in water cold enough to need thermal protection, don't fail to
> >consider a drysuit. They're expensive as all getout, but if you buy the
> >right one, are usable in a wider range of temperatures than a wetsuit.
> >
> >> One other thing worth mentioning, the smallest guy there had the most
> >> trouble (I had none, thank you very much) on the last night's dives.
> >
> >Nobody said that small guys are automatically better, or worse divers.
> >
> >> He started his emergency ascent without his regulator and he had to put
> >> that back in. He had to do his navigation twice because
> >> he fucked up as well as a couple of other minor issues.
> >
> >Did he pass too? If so, you might want to consider how much reliance to
put
> >in the advice, on consumption or anything else, of the instructor that
> >signed his card.
> >
> Yes, he did pass. But, he was made to complete his skills. He also
> had done his initial training a few months ago. But, being the
> technician I am, I have no doubt from my observation that muscle mass
> is indeed the biggest factor in the amount of air consumed. Keep in
> mind that if I quit my powerlifting training, I would waste away to
> about half the amount of muscle mass I have presently, perhaps more.
>
> It takes a massive amount of energy to fuel a powerlifter who trains 4
> days/week. This is a good thing. I can eat and drink whatever I
> want. 18% bodyfat isn't going to get me on the cover of any magazine
> either but it is probably less than most Americans over the age of 40.
> My point is Lee, that even though you've been diving for years, you
> have probably only experienced diving mostly with people who fit
> comfortably inside the bell curve as far as America in general. Muscle
> mass doesn't vary much among them. It does with us folks on the
> extreme ends of the bell. Perhaps you've given too much credence to
> ones comfortability is in the water. Just for the fuck of it, what
> are your vital statistics? Height, weight, bodyfat %, age, etc.?
>


I'd be willing to wager that, as you get more comfortable in the water,
you'll find that you'll consume less air.
You'll also find that diving warmer water will help as well.

Do check into getting a drysuit. I'll either be in a skin/trilaminate or a
drysuit. Hadnt worn a wetsuit in years.
Whats your cardiovascular/aerobic fitness level like? Add walking/swimming
to your repetoire will help out.

Dennis

On Thu, 25 May 2006 03:05:02 -0500, "Dennis \(Icarus\)"
<nojunkmail@ever.invalid> wrote in rec.scuba:

>"John Hanson" <jhanson@northernlinks.com> wrote in message
>news:5k9a72do7pqhuceij7lqtkog4lgpd9l87q@4ax.com.. .
>> On Wed, 24 May 2006 23:32:45 -0400, "Lee Bell"
>> <pleebell2@bellsouth.net> wrote in rec.scuba:
>>
>> >"John Hanson" wrote
>> >
>> >> Well, I passed my open water last night. I and two other guys did our
>> >> lake dives on Monday and Tuesday evening.
>> >
>> >Congratulations. Welcome to the ranks of certified divers.
>> >
>> >> I discovered one thing that I feared I might. I'm probably going to
>have
>> >> to get a custom made wetsuit.
>> >
>> >Many people do.
>> >
>> >> So, anyone able to recommend a good wetsuit company that custom makes a
>> >> wetsuit inexpensively?
>> >
>> >Unfortunately, inexpensive and diving are not terms often found together.
>> >You'll have to shop around. The best advise I can offer is to try to go
>to
>> >the shop to be measured. Chances of someone with a powerlifter's build
>> >finding someone who can build a suit correctly for them without more than
>> >the normal few measurements seem to high to take the chance. If you are
>> >occasionally in South Florida, there's a custom wetsuit shop in
>Hollywood.
>> >
>> >I don't know where you are diving, but if you expect to be doing
>relatively
>> >long dives in water cold enough to need thermal protection, don't fail to
>> >consider a drysuit. They're expensive as all getout, but if you buy the
>> >right one, are usable in a wider range of temperatures than a wetsuit.
>> >
>> >> One other thing worth mentioning, the smallest guy there had the most
>> >> trouble (I had none, thank you very much) on the last night's dives.
>> >
>> >Nobody said that small guys are automatically better, or worse divers.
>> >
>> >> He started his emergency ascent without his regulator and he had to put
>> >> that back in. He had to do his navigation twice because
>> >> he fucked up as well as a couple of other minor issues.
>> >
>> >Did he pass too? If so, you might want to consider how much reliance to
>put
>> >in the advice, on consumption or anything else, of the instructor that
>> >signed his card.
>> >
>> Yes, he did pass. But, he was made to complete his skills. He also
>> had done his initial training a few months ago. But, being the
>> technician I am, I have no doubt from my observation that muscle mass
>> is indeed the biggest factor in the amount of air consumed. Keep in
>> mind that if I quit my powerlifting training, I would waste away to
>> about half the amount of muscle mass I have presently, perhaps more.
>>
>> It takes a massive amount of energy to fuel a powerlifter who trains 4
>> days/week. This is a good thing. I can eat and drink whatever I
>> want. 18% bodyfat isn't going to get me on the cover of any magazine
>> either but it is probably less than most Americans over the age of 40.
>> My point is Lee, that even though you've been diving for years, you
>> have probably only experienced diving mostly with people who fit
>> comfortably inside the bell curve as far as America in general. Muscle
>> mass doesn't vary much among them. It does with us folks on the
>> extreme ends of the bell. Perhaps you've given too much credence to
>> ones comfortability is in the water. Just for the fuck of it, what
>> are your vital statistics? Height, weight, bodyfat %, age, etc.?
>>
>
>
>I'd be willing to wager that, as you get more comfortable in the water,
>you'll find that you'll consume less air.
>You'll also find that diving warmer water will help as well.
>
I'm sure that is the case. But with all my training dives, and all
divers had the same experience level, the variable that was always
proportional to air consumption was muscle mass/skeletal size.

>Do check into getting a drysuit. I'll either be in a skin/trilaminate or a
>drysuit. Hadnt worn a wetsuit in years.
>Whats your cardiovascular/aerobic fitness level like? Add walking/swimming
>to your repetoire will help out.
>
My cardiovascular/aerobic fitness is higher than average. I took the
dogs (http://northernlinks.com/yohan/BuddyAndBailey.jpg) for two walks
on Sunday. The first one was 2.5 miles, the second about a mile. We
ran part of the way. I do that a couple times per week and it's
fairly typical for me.

"John Hanson" wrote

> But, being the technician I am, I have no doubt from my observation that
> muscle mass
> is indeed the biggest factor in the amount of air consumed.

You're still wrong. Size (resistance), lung volume (amount used per breath)
are factors, but not the most important factors. Muscle mass may also be a
factor, but I still have doubts. The individual I mentioned to you earlier
is one of the most accomplished divers in the world, is roughly your size
and had very low body fat and very high muscle mass. He also had one of the
lowest consumption rates of any diver I've ever met. Anyone that knows him,
or knows of him can confirm this. If he can do it, you can do it.

I'll say it once again. Being comfortable and relaxed in the water is the
number one factor in achieving the lowest possible consumption. It's not
the only factor, but it is the most significant one.

Lee

On Thu, 25 May 2006 17:11:37 -0500, John Hanson wrote:

> Got any pictures of him?

One not very good one here:

http://www.huntzinger.com/dive/strokes/gi.jpg

This one is maybe better:

http://www.gavinscooters.com

--
Art Greenberg
artg at eclipse dot net

On Thu, 25 May 2006 23:38:45 -0000, Art Greenberg <none@none.invalid>
wrote in rec.scuba:

>On Thu, 25 May 2006 17:11:37 -0500, John Hanson wrote:
>
>> Got any pictures of him?
>
>One not very good one here:
>
> http://www.huntzinger.com/dive/strokes/gi.jpg
>
>This one is maybe better:
>
> http://www.gavinscooters.com

He's above average in that one. He looks to be quite a bit smaller in
the first one, which appears to be a much more recent pic.

"Lee Bell" wrote

>> But, being the technician I am, I have no doubt from my observation that
>> muscle mass
>> is indeed the biggest factor in the amount of air consumed.
>
> You're still wrong. Size (resistance), lung volume (amount used per
> breath) are factors, but not the most important factors. Muscle mass may
> also be a factor, but I still have doubts. The individual I mentioned to
> you earlier is one of the most accomplished divers in the world, is
> roughly your size and had very low body fat and very high muscle mass. He
> also had one of the lowest consumption rates of any diver I've ever met.
> Anyone that knows him, or knows of him can confirm this. If he can do it,
> you can do it.

Confirm.

On Thu, 25 May 2006 18:49:29 -0500, John Hanson wrote:
> On Thu, 25 May 2006 23:38:45 -0000, Art Greenberg <none@none.invalid>
> wrote in rec.scuba:
>
> >On Thu, 25 May 2006 17:11:37 -0500, John Hanson wrote:
> >
> >> Got any pictures of him?
> >
> >One not very good one here:
> >
> > http://www.huntzinger.com/dive/strokes/gi.jpg
> >
> >This one is maybe better:
> >
> > http://www.gavinscooters.com
>
> He's above average in that one. He looks to be quite a bit smaller in
> the first one, which appears to be a much more recent pic.

No, I think the first one is very old. Probably 5-6 years or more.

--
Art Greenberg
artg at eclipse dot net