Chlorine gas from Volkswagen and Audi TDI cars?

Interviewed about his opinion about my observation, that my
VW T4 TDI bus emits a lung damaging gas, a leading german
hyperbaric physician stated, that same gases were emitted by
his Audi A6 TDI.
His Audi garage had told him that these were chlorine gases,
set free by heat from the exhaust system, generated by the
chassis subside protective spray cover.

Makes sense. But why didn't it make it to the headlines like
"VW gases customers and environment?"

I have heard more than a few reports about these noxious
emissions, gathering them while seeking a cause for my dive
accident.

Matthias

"Matthias Voss" <spammat.voss@gmx.de> wrote in message
news:eana30$s1o$01$1@news.t-online.com...
> Interviewed about his opinion about my observation, that my VW T4 TDI bus
> emits a lung damaging gas, a leading german hyperbaric physician stated,
> that same gases were emitted by his Audi A6 TDI.
> His Audi garage had told him that these were chlorine gases, set free by
> heat from the exhaust system, generated by the chassis subside protective
> spray cover.
>
> Makes sense. But why didn't it make it to the headlines like
> "VW gases customers and environment?"
>
> I have heard more than a few reports about these noxious emissions,
> gathering them while seeking a cause for my dive accident.


Maybe hugh huntzinger and the engineers can be a little more informative
on this, or how to find out, but US vehicles, and so I would assume imports,
have to undergo a "shed test", where they are hermetically sealed in a
"shed" and checked, idling vs. parked-not-running, as rumor in dealerships
has it, for hydrocarbons emitting from the cars' evaporative fuel control
systems, but also from interior components and materials when the car just
sits on its ass parked.

Sunlight on the interior is a big factor for release of gasses, so I read,
but this information is 20 plus years old, and from sources unknown. It
seems to me that if they monitor one gas, they would, or at least could,
monitor others, and this data would be available somewhere.

Just food for thought.
--

Popeye
I have discovered that all human evil comes from this,
man's being unable to sit still in a room. -Pascal
www.finalprotectivefire.com

Popeye wrote:
> "Matthias Voss" <spammat.voss@gmx.de> wrote:
> > Interviewed about his opinion about my observation, that my VW T4 TDI bus
> > emits a lung damaging gas, a leading german hyperbaric physician stated,
> > that same gases were emitted by his Audi A6 TDI.

Humans emit lung damaging gasses too. Plus some noxious stuff that
merely makes you promptly WISH that you were dead.


> > His Audi garage had told him that these were chlorine gases, set free by
> > heat from the exhaust system, generated by the chassis subside protective
> > spray cover.

Ummm...sounds like undercoating burning off a new car's exhaust pipes.
At first blush, it would be a temporary condition.


> > Makes sense. But why didn't it make it to the headlines like
> > "VW gases customers and environment?"

That would only be appropriate if the undercoating that VW is using is
different from the one that everyone else is using.


> > I have heard more than a few reports about these noxious emissions,
> > gathering them while seeking a cause for my dive accident.
>
> Maybe hugh huntzinger and the engineers can be a little more informative
> on this...

I had originally missed that thread while I was away on vacation. In
reading back through it, the 'rotten eggs' smell would be sulphur,
which doesn't make much sense, since Europe's been running Ultra Low
Sulpher fuel now for a couple of years - - unless Matthias is
inadvertantly using an illegal blend that's coming in from non-EU
Eastern block.

FWIW, the USA was supposed to have been 50% of the way to transition to
ultra-low as of last month, but it looks like this deadline got pushed
back to Fall 2006. It has been the "high" sulphur content in USA fuel
that's been preventing automakers from bringing in lots of diesels to
the USA marketplace...ie, they can't run clean enough for the EPA when
they have to be tested with the USA's dirty fuel.


> .... or how to find out, but US vehicles, and so I would assume imports,
> have to undergo a "shed test", where they are hermetically sealed in a
> "shed" and checked, idling vs. parked-not-running, as rumor in dealerships
> has it, for hydrocarbons emitting from the cars' evaporative fuel control
> systems, but also from interior components and materials when the car just
> sits on its ass parked.

And there's probably some amount of new car "break in" allowed in such
tests.


> Sunlight on the interior is a big factor for release of gasses, so I read,
> but this information is 20 plus years old, and from sources unknown. It
> seems to me that if they monitor one gas, they would, or at least could,
> monitor others, and this data would be available somewhere.
>
> Just food for thought.

Digesting. Overall, I'd have reservations with trying to attribute
Matthias's dive related ailment to one specific automobile,
particularly as soon as the vehicle gets out with other traffic.
Granted, it could be something like a defect that has caused an exhaust
leak, but if that were the case, we would expect to see health issues
crop up from CO/CO2 long before the tiny "PPB" effects from
combustion-derived acids.

And if I understood correctly that both Matthias and his SO having
apparently having had the same type of ailment "recently", then I'd be
more inclined to look at their diving protocols to see if there's any
habits that the buddy team shares that could represent a higher risk
exposure.

Another factor could be that if it is something related to diesel,
Europe has adopted diesel very broadly very quickly...IIRC, they passed
the 50% mark for new *car* sales in 2003 or 2004.


-hh

hh wrote

> Overall, I'd have reservations with trying to attribute
> Matthias's dive related ailment to one specific automobile,
> particularly as soon as the vehicle gets out with other traffic.
> Granted, it could be something like a defect that has caused an exhaust
> leak, but if that were the case, we would expect to see health issues
> crop up from CO/CO2 long before the tiny "PPB" effects from
> combustion-derived acids.

I've not followed this thread with any consistency, but since we're talking
about potential gas effects here, let's don't forget to check the gas in the
tanks that have been used, particularly if the symptoms are being
experienced by people that dive together, and presumably, get their gas from
the same source. Let's also remember that what Matthias is experiencing may
be the combined or cumulative effect of exposure to gases that,
individually, would not be harmful.

Lee

Matthias,

> Do you know, by chance, what they call ultra low, in the
> USA, vs. what we have here now?

The pumps around here (Hess stations in Brandon, FL) have "LOW SULPHER"
lables on them...

cheers,
Chris

That was Hugh.

--

Popeye
I have discovered that all human evil comes from this,
man's being unable to sit still in a room. -Pascal
www.finalprotectivefire.com


"Chris" <curran.chris@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1154436520.270662.17430@i42g2000cwa.googlegro ups.com...
> Popeye,
>
>> Another factor could be that if it is something related to diesel,
>
> Naw....
>
>> Europe has adopted diesel very broadly very quickly...IIRC, they passed
>> the 50% mark for new *car* sales in 2003 or 2004.
>
> You recall correctly....
>
> diesel driver,
> Chris
>

Lee Bell wrote:

> hh wrote
>
>
>>Overall, I'd have reservations with trying to attribute
>>Matthias's dive related ailment to one specific automobile,
>>particularly as soon as the vehicle gets out with other traffic.
>>Granted, it could be something like a defect that has caused an exhaust
>>leak, but if that were the case, we would expect to see health issues
>>crop up from CO/CO2 long before the tiny "PPB" effects from
>>combustion-derived acids.
>
>
> I've not followed this thread with any consistency, but since we're talking
> about potential gas effects here, let's don't forget to check the gas in the
> tanks that have been used,


I fully agree that I have to check the gas in the tank, so
much more because I bought it used and filled. However,
there were no evident smells or something. And no signs of
carbon monoxide poisoning.

Matthias