Hall's Dive Center: The WORST diving experience in my 30 years in diving:

flyboy08 wrote:

> For those that have ONLY dived without a DM...I feel sorry for you.

I fail to see why.

As one of our more "colorful" members might remark, "DMs are only good
for brewing coffee, if that".

> I guess that limits your diving to the KEYS? Maybe Bonaire?

Hardly.

> My last four dives in the KEYS were in fact with DM, granted 6 years
> ago, so this was a bit unusal for me.

As others have said, it is unusal for the Keys, except upon request.
I have been on charters without any Dm's even onboard the boat, just a
Captain. Nor were any needed, at all.

> The main fact is that Halls should have been able to predict the vis
> and informed professionally. I asked twice. What more could I have
> done.

Ask returning divers the trip/day before??? Don't feel so bad. I once
went to the Keys in late summer,
rented a house on the water for a week ($+-1000), dragged my boat the
whole damn way (5hr drive),
and never left the dock due to crap weather.

Such is weather in Fla.

> I wonder what would happen if I could'nt predict the level 4
> thunderstorm 100 miles ahead of my plane and route and flew right into
> it? And I wonder what would happen if you or your loved one bounced
> their head off the fuslage and cause injury???As a pilot, it is MY
> responsibility for the safety of the plane and crew....This should be
> no different from a dive boat.

You did not encounter any "unsafe" boat operations as far as I can
tell.

As for your pilot analogy, lets suppose a passenger came up to you
after a flight said,
"I wanted to take some very memorable pictures of the Grand Canyon on
our plane trip
and all these clouds -you didn't tell me about- obscured the
visibilty".

"Why didn't you tell me about those clouds over the Grand Canyon prior
to the trip?
You said it would be clear weather, remember?"

"Do I get a discount on my plane ticket? It was not clear the whole
way, like you said."

> The captain was obviously a hired hand. Once we docked, he was off the
> boat and in his car in a New York Second...GONE.

I've never had an airline pilot stay around after landing either. I bet
they go straight to the bar.

> Everyone has an opinion, thanks for sharing!

I would recommend asking here, in rec.scuba.locations, or on any of the
other popular boards
as there are many fine, smaller ops in the Keys with vocal, repeat
fans.

Sorry about your wash-out but given nice conditions and a real pro,
caring, operator the Keys still
remain perhaps the best diving in the USA.
--
SJM

Scott McFadden wrote:

> Sorry about your wash-out but given nice conditions and a real pro,
> caring, operator the Keys still
> remain perhaps the best diving in the USA.


The best diving in the USA is in Canada, regardless of your operator.
:)

flyboy08 wrote:

> While still in the shop, we were informed that the dive master on our
> boat would not be in the water with us? Hmmm, I have dived the world
> and never experienced this before, but I have 300 plus dives and many
> from the key's years back. With the Visibility as stated, I was not
> concerned being in the water with just my wife and daughter. We were
> the only divers going out at this point.
>
I have dove off Va.Beach, Morehead City NC, Cozumel, Cayman Brac,
Bonaire, Curacao, Florida Keys,a liveaboard in the Caribbean, Boynton
Beach and numerous springs and caves in Fla. The ONLY place I have ever
been where they put a DM in the water with you was Cozumel. The reason
for that was all of our diving was drift diving and the operator didn't
want the group getting scattered about and didn't want to burden each
diver with a dive float.

I have had few DMs get in the water initially, dive briefly and back on
the boat after 10-15 minutes.

I would rather have the DM on the boat when I get back to help me on the
boat.

The boat operators responsibility is to get you to and from the dive site.

I think in the interest in good customer relations, Hall's should have
refunded a portion of your money but they were under no obligatioin to
do so.

One of the boat captains in Morehead City NC I dive with regularly, took
us out a few years ago. Conditions were marginal but we decided to go.
We got a hour out of port and he stopped the boat and gave us a choice.
Where we were going, it was 8-9ft seas and we were already in 4-5 foot
seas. He said if the group wanted to go, he would take us there but
there would be no refund if we decided not to dive. The second option
was to dive a location closer into shore but viz and conditions would be
poor. The third option was to return to port and he would refund our
money. We returned to port. The next day, we tried again and had
exactly the same results. We got our money back for both boat trips. I
think this captain went far above and beyond and undoubtedly, he lost
money that day. However, I have recommended him many times over and
have dove with his operation many times since.

nitespark wrote:

> flyboy08 wrote:
>
>> While still in the shop, we were informed that the dive master on our
>> boat would not be in the water with us? Hmmm, I have dived the world
>> and never experienced this before, but I have 300 plus dives and many
>> from the key's years back. With the Visibility as stated, I was not
>> concerned being in the water with just my wife and daughter. We were
>> the only divers going out at this point.
>>
> I have dove off Va.Beach, Morehead City NC, Cozumel, Cayman Brac,
> Bonaire, Curacao, Florida Keys,a liveaboard in the Caribbean, Boynton
> Beach and numerous springs and caves in Fla. The ONLY place I have ever
> been where they put a DM in the water with you was Cozumel. The reason
> for that was all of our diving was drift diving and the operator didn't
> want the group getting scattered about and didn't want to burden each
> diver with a dive float.
>
> I have had few DMs get in the water initially, dive briefly and back on
> the boat after 10-15 minutes.
>
> I would rather have the DM on the boat when I get back to help me on the
> boat.
>
> The boat operators responsibility is to get you to and from the dive site.
>
> I think in the interest in good customer relations, Hall's should have
> refunded a portion of your money but they were under no obligatioin to
> do so.
>
> One of the boat captains in Morehead City NC I dive with regularly, took
> us out a few years ago. Conditions were marginal but we decided to go.
> We got a hour out of port and he stopped the boat and gave us a choice.
> Where we were going, it was 8-9ft seas and we were already in 4-5 foot
> seas. He said if the group wanted to go, he would take us there but
> there would be no refund if we decided not to dive. The second option
> was to dive a location closer into shore but viz and conditions would be
> poor. The third option was to return to port and he would refund our
> money. We returned to port. The next day, we tried again and had
> exactly the same results. We got our money back for both boat trips. I
> think this captain went far above and beyond and undoubtedly, he lost
> money that day. However, I have recommended him many times over and
> have dove with his operation many times since.


Oh hell, lets face it.....

It's Bush's fault.



--
“TAANSTAFL”
__________________________________________________ __________________________

"A prudent man foresees the difficulties ahead and prepares for them;
The simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences." - Proverbs 22:3
__________________________________________________ __________________________

flyboy08 wrote:
> As in all walks of life and yes, even in blogs and in forum's, there
> always that one A$$ Hole that feels he knows it all and would argue the
> most minute point.
>
> You add nothing of valus like the others have to my post, I'm thinking
> you work at Hall's or know someone that does...move along sponge...
>

AW..RIGHT!!!! That's the spirit! If someone doesn't agree with you
they re automatically an asshole or a shill for your antagonist. You'll
fit right in here!



--
Ray Contreras
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Webmonkey for:
http://www.ossystems.com
http://www.bobs-garage.com
http://www.coltri-usa.com
http://www.rayzplace.com

Lee Bell wrote:
> flyboy08 wrote
>
>
> > You add nothing of valus like the others have to my post, I'm thinking
> > you work at Hall's or know someone that does...move along sponge...
>
> Wrong latitude and longitude by about as far as it's possible to be wrong
> and still be in the US.
>
> You had a bad day in the Keys. We've all had them. Halls does not have the
> best reputation either as a training agency or as a dive charter, but
> they're not much different from a whole host of other tourist boat
> operations.
>
> There are operators in the Keys who could have found better visibility for
> you, but they would have had to take you to considerably deeper sites to do
> it. I get the impression that at least some of your family divers, perhaps
> all of you, aren't really comfortable with deep diving. Of course I could
> be wrong, but that's how it sounded.
>
> Sorry you had a bad time, but, while Halls didn't do anything particularly
> right, they didn't do anything particularly wrong either.
>
> Next time, check with us before you go and, perhaps we can hook you up with
> something you'll like better. Some of us liver here. Others visit often.
>
> Keep an eye on the "any diving plans for Aught7?" thread started by Dan
> Bracuc and you might even get a chance to meet some of the jerks that
> responded to you . . . including me. We dive a lot nicer than we newsgroup.
>
> Lee

Thanks Lee...I have taken an advanced open water along with Wreck
diving courses. I'm very comfortable at depth and my deepest was
145-156 in the blue Hole!! Three times!

My wife and daughter on the other hand are just open water certified,
so my blah...blah...blahing was more for the safety of the family...my
main intent whenever I\we do extreme sports....

The Keys were a VERY last minute choice and only for three days before
we headed up to Palm Coast to visit with family.

FYI....We went to Roatan in August 05 as a family trip. I have been
back twice w/out the family as we ended up purchasing a lot there for
future development....I see myself diving their often and without a
DM...

flyboy08 wrote

> Thanks Lee...I have taken an advanced open water along with Wreck
> diving courses. I'm very comfortable at depth and my deepest was
> 145-156 in the blue Hole!! Three times!

You're welcome. BTW, your statement that you're comfortable at depth and
the depths you're comfortable with means more here than your certifications.

> My wife and daughter on the other hand are just open water certifiedg . .
> .

That was my guess.

> The Keys were a VERY last minute choice and only for three days before
> we headed up to Palm Coast to visit with family.

> FYI....We went to Roatan in August 05 as a family trip. I have been
> back twice w/out the family as we ended up purchasing a lot there for
> future development....I see myself diving their often and without a
> DM...

Well, if you can't live in S. Florida, I suppose Roatan isn't a bad second
choice <grin>.

Lee

PS: Don't let Scott tell you the Pacific NW has the best diving in the US.
He's biased.

Jerome's Sock Puppet wrote

>> Temperatures will drop precipitously, all the way down to the mid to
>> upper 60's . . . maybe.

> Well lets hope it's a dry heat. I do believe I would wilt like the
> delicate flower I am...

Yeah, me too.

Lee

"El Stroko Guapo" <omgray@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:qPBoh.8736$yx6.5523@newsread2.news.pas.earthl ink.net...
> Most Florida operators do not put a DM in the water. I ask if I have not
> used the operator before; if they put a DM in the water I don't go out
> with them. You should have asked, too.
>
> As for the viz thing, I have a little more sympathy. There are about
> twenty seven thousand operators in the upper keys (maybe a half dozen
> competent ones). They all have radios. They all tie up at the same five
> buoys. There is no excuse for not knowing what the viz is, unless you are
> the very first boat out in the morning. Anyone who tells an afternoon dive
> that the viz is 30-40 when it's arm's length is either stupid or ripping
> off the tourists.
>
> Personally, I try to avoid the tourist destinations.

I've never seen 2 ft of viz anywhere in the Keys in a score of trips, and
near ten score dives.

That's from mm99 to mm0.

I've never seen 2 ft of viz -inside- the Duane or the Bibb.

At any rate, viz isn't like predicting where a cat 4 storm will be in
front of your plane.

It's like predicting where a cloud will be, in front of your plane.

At a precise place and time.

A seasoned diver should know that.

"flyboy08" <phoward@aeroconsulting.com> wrote in message
news:1168307832.592984.81690@v33g2000cwv.googlegro ups.com...
>
(snip)> FYI....We went to Roatan in August 05 as a family trip. I have been
> back twice w/out the family as we ended up purchasing a lot there for
> future development....I see myself diving their often and without a
> DM...

I've spent a lot of time diving in Roatan. I was just there for a week in
late November. Never got wet. Weather and bad conditions happen.