Dry Suit recommendations?

On Mon, 16 Aug 2004 03:17:29 GMT, "Doug Haskins"
<nowhere@somewhere.net> wrote:

>Shell only. This is similar to what I had before. It requires some kind of
>clothing underneath (like wooley bears), is light, easy to transport and
>easy to put on.

That's my preference.

>7mm compressed. This suit is the same thickness as a wetsuit, but is
>apparently dry. I know nothing about this type. It seems heavy and I don't
>really understand the benefit of having that much neoprene for a dry suit?
>Why so thick?

Waste of money. They have all of the bad aspects of a wetsuit... both
buoyancy and insulation properties drop with depth. The only
advantage is that you are nearly as "slick" in the water as with a
wetsuit. I'd be tempted to say that you could get away with one for
temperate waters, but they still do the opposite of what you need...
their insulation would be greatest above the thermocline.

>4mm compressed. This is compressed with a different method (or something).
>Obviously 4mm is much lighter than the 7mm, but it seems the price goes up
>to have less at the same time? Does that make sense to anyone?

A true compressed or crushed neoprene SHOULD NOT be lighter than a
suit made from the same stock material. If you crush a 7mm fabric
down to 4mm, it doesn't get lighter.
The only compressed or crushed neoprene suit that I would trust would
be the DUI CF200 or the FX50/50 series. The CF200 is 100% crushed
neoprene, while the 50/50 has crushed pants and a shell shirt.

Crushed neoprene is far more durable than trilam, if you're into
crawling over rocks and wrecks.

>With the compressed suits, do you wear a bathing suit underneath and thats
>it? is that why they are so thick?

The compressed suit offers little insulation of it's own. I'd wear
the same thing that I'd wear under a shell suit.

>My DUI drysuit shell used to leak slightly around the wrists. I guess that
>can be eliminated now by using the sealed gloves.

Yup.

>If a shell suit leaks, your wooley bears get soaked and your cold in the
>water. Also if you don't have enough air in the suit and a part of it
>compresses against your woolies you will feel the cold. Does this go away
>with the compressed suits?

Nope.

> I mean, if your wearing just a bathing suit
>(assuming that is the idea) and your suit leaks, will you still be warm
>while diving?

Get an undersuit made from 3M's Thinsulate. Diving Concepts, DUI, and
Bare all make good suits. I use the Bare CT200. This is a 200 gram
Thinsulate plus a liner of 200g Polarfleece. Thinsulate retains much
of it's insulating properties even when wet, and it does not require
that you maintain a lot of air in your suit.
Personally, I dive with the shoulder dump valve all the way open and
use only enough air to relieve the squeeze.




--- Rich
http://richlockyer.tripod.com/

Hi there,

Just some comments from a diver within the Scandinavian areas - I guess the
temperature here is app the same as your place, that means during winter 0
degree Celsius......
>
> >7mm compressed. This suit is the same thickness as a wetsuit, but is
> >apparently dry. I know nothing about this type. It seems heavy and I
don't
> >really understand the benefit of having that much neoprene for a dry
suit?
> >Why so thick?
>
> >4mm compressed. This is compressed with a different method (or
something).
> >Obviously 4mm is much lighter than the 7mm, but it seems the price goes
up
> >to have less at the same time? Does that make sense to anyone?
>

I use a Henderson Arctic drysuit, which is 4mm compressed, with a Bear 100g
undersuit (Thinsulate), which is perfect for me - and I don't have too much
body fat - even during winter. In summertime I only wear a t-shirt - thats a
flexibility you don't have with the shell. I tried the shell type, and don't
feel much difference unless in shallow waters (2 m) in regards to bouyancy.

> A true compressed or crushed neoprene SHOULD NOT be lighter than a
> suit made from the same stock material. If you crush a 7mm fabric
> down to 4mm, it doesn't get lighter.
> The only compressed or crushed neoprene suit that I would trust would
> be the DUI CF200 or the FX50/50 series. The CF200 is 100% crushed
> neoprene, while the 50/50 has crushed pants and a shell shirt.
>
> Crushed neoprene is far more durable than trilam, if you're into
> crawling over rocks and wrecks.

That's a fact. A lot of my buddies who has a shell, often tear holes in
them - especially on wreck dives.
>
> >With the compressed suits, do you wear a bathing suit underneath and
thats
> >it? is that why they are so thick?
>
> The compressed suit offers little insulation of it's own. I'd wear
> the same thing that I'd wear under a shell suit.
>
> >My DUI drysuit shell used to leak slightly around the wrists. I guess
that
> >can be eliminated now by using the sealed gloves.
>
I haven't seen such problems on my Henderson

>
> >If a shell suit leaks, your wooley bears get soaked and your cold in the
> >water. Also if you don't have enough air in the suit and a part of it
> >compresses against your woolies you will feel the cold. Does this go away
> >with the compressed suits?
>
> Nope.
>
> > I mean, if your wearing just a bathing suit
> >(assuming that is the idea) and your suit leaks, will you still be warm
> >while diving?
>
> Get an undersuit made from 3M's Thinsulate. Diving Concepts, DUI, and
> Bare all make good suits. I use the Bare CT200. This is a 200 gram
> Thinsulate plus a liner of 200g Polarfleece. Thinsulate retains much
> of it's insulating properties even when wet, and it does not require
> that you maintain a lot of air in your suit.
> Personally, I dive with the shoulder dump valve all the way open and
> use only enough air to relieve the squeeze.
>
>

Me too
>
>
> --- Rich
> http://richlockyer.tripod.com/


Regards,

Henrik

On Thu, 19 Aug 2004 17:06:19 +0200, "HKN"
<mabehemaFJERN@DETTEtdcadsl.dk> wrote:

>> >My DUI drysuit shell used to leak slightly around the wrists. I guess
>that
>> >can be eliminated now by using the sealed gloves.
>>
>I haven't seen such problems on my Henderson

This is dependent on each diver. Even when I was significantly
overweight, the tendons on my wrists are very pronounced, and any hint
of a "grasp" would result in a flooded arm.... Typhoon and DUI suits.

I ended up going with the Diving Concepts drygloves.





--- Rich
http://richlockyer.tripod.com/

> A true compressed or crushed neoprene SHOULD NOT be lighter than a
> suit made from the same stock material. If you crush a 7mm fabric
> down to 4mm, it doesn't get lighter.
> The only compressed or crushed neoprene suit that I would trust would
> be the DUI CF200 or the FX50/50 series. The CF200 is 100% crushed
> neoprene, while the 50/50 has crushed pants and a shell shirt.


FWIW, I had a DUI CF200 SP crushed neoprene with a warmneck and zipper
guard. I used to teach up in the northeast and this was a great suit for
cold water with the right underware and when the water warmed up I used to
wear shorts and a t-shirt. Never had a zipper problem, never had any leaks
and the seals held up great. I would buy another one in a heartbeat. It
was expensive but to me it was worth it.

Jay

Hello.

I'm getting back into diving after a rather long hiatus (14 years). I did my
first dive Sat using rental gear and I'm planning on purchasing a dry suit
since I will be diving primarily in Western Canada and the water here is
dang cold.

I used to own a DUI drysuit shell which I wore with wooley bears underneath.
I sold it about 10 years ago because I didn't plan on doing more diving and
the wrist and neck seals were starting to suffer UV damage.

Looking at the suits out on the market these days there are lots of
different types and I'm wondering if someone can recommend something. Here
is what I see out there.

Shell only. This is similar to what I had before. It requires some kind of
clothing underneath (like wooley bears), is light, easy to transport and
easy to put on.

7mm compressed. This suit is the same thickness as a wetsuit, but is
apparently dry. I know nothing about this type. It seems heavy and I don't
really understand the benefit of having that much neoprene for a dry suit?
Why so thick?

4mm compressed. This is compressed with a different method (or something).
Obviously 4mm is much lighter than the 7mm, but it seems the price goes up
to have less at the same time? Does that make sense to anyone?

With the compressed suits, do you wear a bathing suit underneath and thats
it? is that why they are so thick?

My DUI drysuit shell used to leak slightly around the wrists. I guess that
can be eliminated now by using the sealed gloves.

If a shell suit leaks, your wooley bears get soaked and your cold in the
water. Also if you don't have enough air in the suit and a part of it
compresses against your woolies you will feel the cold. Does this go away
with the compressed suits? I mean, if your wearing just a bathing suit
(assuming that is the idea) and your suit leaks, will you still be warm
while diving?

Has anyone tried all of these types that could comment/recommend one
perhaps? Perhaps there are other types out now that I am not aware of?

I would love to read your opinions.

Thanks.

Doug.

On Mon, 16 Aug 2004 03:17:29 GMT, "Doug Haskins"
<nowhere@somewhere.net> wrote:

>Shell only. This is similar to what I had before. It requires some kind of
>clothing underneath (like wooley bears), is light, easy to transport and
>easy to put on.

That's my preference.

>7mm compressed. This suit is the same thickness as a wetsuit, but is
>apparently dry. I know nothing about this type. It seems heavy and I don't
>really understand the benefit of having that much neoprene for a dry suit?
>Why so thick?

Waste of money. They have all of the bad aspects of a wetsuit... both
buoyancy and insulation properties drop with depth. The only
advantage is that you are nearly as "slick" in the water as with a
wetsuit. I'd be tempted to say that you could get away with one for
temperate waters, but they still do the opposite of what you need...
their insulation would be greatest above the thermocline.

>4mm compressed. This is compressed with a different method (or something).
>Obviously 4mm is much lighter than the 7mm, but it seems the price goes up
>to have less at the same time? Does that make sense to anyone?

A true compressed or crushed neoprene SHOULD NOT be lighter than a
suit made from the same stock material. If you crush a 7mm fabric
down to 4mm, it doesn't get lighter.
The only compressed or crushed neoprene suit that I would trust would
be the DUI CF200 or the FX50/50 series. The CF200 is 100% crushed
neoprene, while the 50/50 has crushed pants and a shell shirt.

Crushed neoprene is far more durable than trilam, if you're into
crawling over rocks and wrecks.

>With the compressed suits, do you wear a bathing suit underneath and thats
>it? is that why they are so thick?

The compressed suit offers little insulation of it's own. I'd wear
the same thing that I'd wear under a shell suit.

>My DUI drysuit shell used to leak slightly around the wrists. I guess that
>can be eliminated now by using the sealed gloves.

Yup.

>If a shell suit leaks, your wooley bears get soaked and your cold in the
>water. Also if you don't have enough air in the suit and a part of it
>compresses against your woolies you will feel the cold. Does this go away
>with the compressed suits?

Nope.

> I mean, if your wearing just a bathing suit
>(assuming that is the idea) and your suit leaks, will you still be warm
>while diving?

Get an undersuit made from 3M's Thinsulate. Diving Concepts, DUI, and
Bare all make good suits. I use the Bare CT200. This is a 200 gram
Thinsulate plus a liner of 200g Polarfleece. Thinsulate retains much
of it's insulating properties even when wet, and it does not require
that you maintain a lot of air in your suit.
Personally, I dive with the shoulder dump valve all the way open and
use only enough air to relieve the squeeze.




--- Rich
http://richlockyer.tripod.com/

Hi there,

Just some comments from a diver within the Scandinavian areas - I guess the
temperature here is app the same as your place, that means during winter 0
degree Celsius......
>
> >7mm compressed. This suit is the same thickness as a wetsuit, but is
> >apparently dry. I know nothing about this type. It seems heavy and I
don't
> >really understand the benefit of having that much neoprene for a dry
suit?
> >Why so thick?
>
> >4mm compressed. This is compressed with a different method (or
something).
> >Obviously 4mm is much lighter than the 7mm, but it seems the price goes
up
> >to have less at the same time? Does that make sense to anyone?
>

I use a Henderson Arctic drysuit, which is 4mm compressed, with a Bear 100g
undersuit (Thinsulate), which is perfect for me - and I don't have too much
body fat - even during winter. In summertime I only wear a t-shirt - thats a
flexibility you don't have with the shell. I tried the shell type, and don't
feel much difference unless in shallow waters (2 m) in regards to bouyancy.

> A true compressed or crushed neoprene SHOULD NOT be lighter than a
> suit made from the same stock material. If you crush a 7mm fabric
> down to 4mm, it doesn't get lighter.
> The only compressed or crushed neoprene suit that I would trust would
> be the DUI CF200 or the FX50/50 series. The CF200 is 100% crushed
> neoprene, while the 50/50 has crushed pants and a shell shirt.
>
> Crushed neoprene is far more durable than trilam, if you're into
> crawling over rocks and wrecks.

That's a fact. A lot of my buddies who has a shell, often tear holes in
them - especially on wreck dives.
>
> >With the compressed suits, do you wear a bathing suit underneath and
thats
> >it? is that why they are so thick?
>
> The compressed suit offers little insulation of it's own. I'd wear
> the same thing that I'd wear under a shell suit.
>
> >My DUI drysuit shell used to leak slightly around the wrists. I guess
that
> >can be eliminated now by using the sealed gloves.
>
I haven't seen such problems on my Henderson

>
> >If a shell suit leaks, your wooley bears get soaked and your cold in the
> >water. Also if you don't have enough air in the suit and a part of it
> >compresses against your woolies you will feel the cold. Does this go away
> >with the compressed suits?
>
> Nope.
>
> > I mean, if your wearing just a bathing suit
> >(assuming that is the idea) and your suit leaks, will you still be warm
> >while diving?
>
> Get an undersuit made from 3M's Thinsulate. Diving Concepts, DUI, and
> Bare all make good suits. I use the Bare CT200. This is a 200 gram
> Thinsulate plus a liner of 200g Polarfleece. Thinsulate retains much
> of it's insulating properties even when wet, and it does not require
> that you maintain a lot of air in your suit.
> Personally, I dive with the shoulder dump valve all the way open and
> use only enough air to relieve the squeeze.
>
>

Me too
>
>
> --- Rich
> http://richlockyer.tripod.com/


Regards,

Henrik

On Thu, 19 Aug 2004 17:06:19 +0200, "HKN"
<mabehemaFJERN@DETTEtdcadsl.dk> wrote:

>> >My DUI drysuit shell used to leak slightly around the wrists. I guess
>that
>> >can be eliminated now by using the sealed gloves.
>>
>I haven't seen such problems on my Henderson

This is dependent on each diver. Even when I was significantly
overweight, the tendons on my wrists are very pronounced, and any hint
of a "grasp" would result in a flooded arm.... Typhoon and DUI suits.

I ended up going with the Diving Concepts drygloves.





--- Rich
http://richlockyer.tripod.com/

> A true compressed or crushed neoprene SHOULD NOT be lighter than a
> suit made from the same stock material. If you crush a 7mm fabric
> down to 4mm, it doesn't get lighter.
> The only compressed or crushed neoprene suit that I would trust would
> be the DUI CF200 or the FX50/50 series. The CF200 is 100% crushed
> neoprene, while the 50/50 has crushed pants and a shell shirt.


FWIW, I had a DUI CF200 SP crushed neoprene with a warmneck and zipper
guard. I used to teach up in the northeast and this was a great suit for
cold water with the right underware and when the water warmed up I used to
wear shorts and a t-shirt. Never had a zipper problem, never had any leaks
and the seals held up great. I would buy another one in a heartbeat. It
was expensive but to me it was worth it.

Jay