Been to Koh Tao, should I go to PERHENTIANS?

"Art Greenberg" wrote

>> Now does anyone know if one's mouth and lungs have to be O2 cleaned
>> before
>> breathing in pure O2?
>
> Yes. It involves inhaling a gallon of Simple Green. As with all aspects of
> technical diving, this requires specialized training. To prevent anyone
> not
> trained in the correct procedure from being injured, I will not disclose
> the
> details.

I'll bet there's a GUE course that covers it. It will only cost $27,000.
The Fundamentals course is a prerequisite.

Lee

<morgand@cix.compulink.co.uk> wrote

>> For safety sake, most people
>> with whom I've dived will only use 36% and below with their regular kit.
>
> Ah......thank you for that, i thought that it must be a pain if your gear
> is "clean" and you turn up somewhere where they dont do Nitrox.

This works OK for everything but tanks. Most shops around here still use a
partial pressure fill process. Those that do, require certification that
the tanks have been cleaned appropriately and trust that they have not been
contaminated since the sticker was applied. The shop I frequent, Fill
Express in Pompano Beach, Florida, banks the standard mixes and will fill
air tanks up to 40%. For 50% and up, they require O2 cleaning.

Lee

In article <1122319086.442102.34580@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups. com>,
recscuba_google@huntzinger.com (-hh) wrote:

> it was an additional charge of $12
> per tank),

And if your doing 30 to 40 dives on a trip thats roughly $480 for the 40
dives EXTRA per person.......christ I've had a week in Bali for the pair
of us for $200 (£125.00) and that was before the bomb.

So......i wont be paying for it thank's.......

Dave Morgan @ Work in the UK
Take out the "goes diving" bit....
Trip photos on line at www.morg.co.uk

<morgand@cix.compulink.co.uk> wrote

>> Hugh's comments do raise an interesting point.

> Its this kind of ineteresting point that my wife picks up on, she literaly
> just wants to dive, and air in a single 12ltr provides that without any
> "must do or must NOT do"...........in other words, she straps one on and
> takes the "one small step..........."

To dive with no more planning than that, one would need to dive with a
computer and stay above the MOD for 21%. Diving with Nitrox differs only in
the design of the computer and the need to tell it what gas you are using.

Lee

Steve Kramer <steve@seatraveler.com> wrote:

> Not quite. HH is having you on a bit. But only just a bit.

And I did include a smiley. Good to hear from you again, Steve.


> For safety sake, most people with whom I've dived will
> only use 36% and below with their regular kit.

This is a reasonable rule of thumb, since 36% is considered to be a
standard mix, whereas 37-40% mixes are not, so its unlikely to encounter
them.


-hh

H Huntzinger wrote:
> morgand@cix.compulink.co.uk wrote:
>
>
>>recscuba_google@huntzinger.com (-hh) wrote:
>>
>>
>>>...it was an additional charge of $12 per tank),
>>
>>And if your doing 30 to 40 dives on a trip thats roughly $480
>>for the 40 dives EXTRA per person.......christ I've had a week
>>in Bali for the pair of us for $200 (£125.00) and that was
>>before the bomb.
>>
>>So......i wont be paying for it thank's.......
>
>
>
> Don't be so quick to judge Nitrox just because I provided one example of
> where it was a very poor value.
>
>
> For example, I did a trip to the Galapagos in 2002 and while I forget
> exactly how much it all cost, I do recall very well that we blew through
> $3000 just for the airfare & hotel transfers to get there/back.
>
> Add to this the cost for two diver-weeks on a liveaboard, and you're
> probably talking another $5K there (probably $6K), so you're easily over
> $8000 for the whole trip by the time you're all done.
>
> If we say that we did 20 dives @ 50 minutes each = 1000 minutes of
> diving for $8000. And $8000/1000 minutes = $8.00 per minute.
>
>
> This operator's cost to upgrade to Nitrox was quite reasonable. I think
> it was only something like $100/pp for the week. So we add another $200
> onto the cost of the trip...its a small 2.5% cost increase. YMMV on
> where to go from here, but one way to hash it out is to say that for the
> Nitrox to be "cost effective", it would have only needed to have
> increased bottom times by more than the total trip's increase in cost:
>
> Assuming that the Nitrox gave us 10% more bottom time, the average 50
> minute dives became 55 minutes:
>
> Same 20 dives, but now @ 55 minutes each = 1100 minutes of diving for
> $8200. For $8200/1100 minutes = $7.45 per minute.
>
>
>
> -hh


2.5% of anything is chump change. IMO.

--
jer
email reply - I am not a 'ten'

H Huntzinger wrote:
> morgand@cix.compulink.co.uk wrote:
>
> > recscuba_google@huntzinger.com (-hh) wrote:
> >
> > > ...it was an additional charge of $12 per tank),
> >
> > And if your doing 30 to 40 dives on a trip thats roughly $480
> > for the 40 dives EXTRA per person.......christ I've had a week
> > in Bali for the pair of us for $200 (£125.00) and that was
> > before the bomb.
> >
> > So......i wont be paying for it thank's.......

< big snip >

After some fancy footwork of travel expenses, hotel, meals, beer,
added to the cost per dive, hh arrived at:

> Assuming that the Nitrox gave us 10% more bottom time, the average 50
> minute dives became 55 minutes:
>
> Same 20 dives, but now @ 55 minutes each = 1100 minutes of diving for
> $8200. For $8200/1100 minutes = $7.45 per minute.

Easier just to say: 5 extra minutes times 20 or extra 100 minutes.

At WHATEVER per minute cost, if morgan's air consumption rate is
good, he could say he saved a BUNDLE by diving air on the eaverage
of 75 minutes per tank.

He would have had 35 x 20 or 700 extra minutes AT NO COST for Nitrox!

YMMV. I am just playing the Devil for morgan!

-- Bob.

In article <1ocFe.9102$oZ.851@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.ne t>,
leebell@ix.remove.netcom.com (Lee Bell) wrote:

>
> It depends on your preferences and how much of a hassel it really is.

We will have to bite the bullet to decide for ourselves........

> I use nitrox on any dive except when I'm going to be deeper than I'm
> comfortable using nitrox.

What is the max depth that you can go with Nitrox ?
I take it the different mix's (%) govern those depth's subject to a max
depth ??

> Increased dive time, however, is a significant
> advantage. When your consumption improves to the point where you
> consistently surface because you've run out of no deco time

We were recently running into deco when we were going over the hour, i
must admit that this was becoming a pain, we just did'nt want to come up
the dive's were so good.

> by giving you a longer no decompression time at the same
> depth or depths.

OK....

> Why not get the training, give it a try and then decide if it's
> something you wish to use for most dives. At worst, you'll learn a bit
> more about the physics and physiology of diving. At best, you'll
> increase the time you get to spend actually doing dives.

I cant argue with that recommendation, it makes sense.
Thanks for that.

Dave Morgan @ Work in the UK
Take out the "goes diving" bit....
Trip photos on line at www.morg.co.uk

morgand@cix.compulink.co.uk wrote:
>
> What is the max depth that you can go with Nitrox ?
> I take it the different mix's (%) govern those depth's
> subject to a max depth ??

The general rule of thumb is that the Maximum Operating Depth (MOD) for
Nitrox is based on the mix and the maximum partial pressure of Oxygen
(PPO2) that you're willing to live with.

The mix is the percentage of O2; 32% and 36% are the common standards.


There's been some debate over time regarding what is an acceptably safe
PPO2 limit. IIRC, it used to be 1.6 PPO2, but the current generally
accepted rule of thumb these days is 1.4 ATM for a working dive, with
the 1.6 PPO2 max reserved for "resting". Enough said about this for
the moment.

As such, the math for a 32% mix and a 1.4 PPO2 limit criteria is:

1.4 ATM / .32 ATM = 4.375 ATM total max pressure.

MOD = ( 4.375 ATM - 1 ATM {surface}) * 33 ft/ATM = 111fsw


....whereas 32% at the 1.6 PPO2 limit would be:

MOD = (1.6/.32 - 1)* 33 = 132fsw


For 36% and 1.4 PPO2 limit:

MOD = (1.4/.36 - 1) * 33 = 95fsw


Very, very generally speaking, the "sweet spot" for getting longer
bottom times by using Nitrox tends to be concentrated in the 50-90fsw
depth range.



-hh

<morgand@cix.compulink.co.uk> wrote

> Thanks to everyone for their twopenuth.
> You can obviously see where i am from.....where are all you dive nuts from

I live in south Florida, believed by many to be the world's best place for a
diver to live . . . well, I believe it.

Lee